Middle Rogue Steelhead/Sea Run Cutthroat

[Darian]

Hi Tony,.... I don't recall ever catching a Sea Run Brown.... Not sure whether there're any in the Smith or on Vancouver Island, either.

Sure would like to catch one but they're not overly numeorus so I've never targeted them....

[jbird]

I havnt heard of browns in the Smith either. I dont know of any river along the west coast that has em. My friend caught one in the estuaries on the east shore of vancouver island a few years back.
j

[bubzilla]

Nice fish guys! Not that it really matters, and I know we partially hashed this out on the Jefferson board a couple years ago, but according to ODFW biologists searuns don't go above the Illinois on the Rogue. What we have above the Illinois, according to the biologists, are fluvial cutts. They migrate but don't go to the sea. Who knows if they're right, but scale samples and calcium ratios don't usually lie. I've seen a guide who shall remain nameless claiming to have caught large searun cutts well into the upper river, and the chances of that, given what the biologists suggest, are extremely low.

P.S. Is there any consensus as to whether there are searun browns on the Trinity? Most of the anglers I've talked to think there are, and I've seen a couple pictures of fish that definitely looked like they might be--of course, that's not a very scientific or conclusive way to judge whether they were ever in the ocean or not.

[Tony Buzolich]

I've got a couple of pictures somewhere if I can find them but this was definitely a brown. The fish was almost totally silver but had the characteristic red spots over the body.

Even went up the street to buy more film so as to get a picture or two.
TONY

[bubzilla]

There are definitely browns in the Trinity. No question about that. Just wasn't sure if there was a definitive statement, from biologists, as to whether there were any searun variety. Lots of fishing literature refers to there being both resident and searun browns on the Trinity--just didn't know if there was some actual science behind it or if it was primarly some of the arm chair stuff we usually have on the Rogue.

[Adam Grace]

I caught my first sea-run cutt during my first trip to the Rogue. It was not as large as the fish above but it was beautiful, all 12 inches. I was very excited to catch another species of fish.

[Darian]

Hey Bub,.... As you point out, there're definitely Browns in the trinity. It's mentioned in some California DFG pub's but mostly in passing which leads me to believe that there's not much scientific evidence available.

I haven't caught any like Tony has but I've seen some of the "sea run" variety and they have the appearance of having been in the salt chuck... Not sure that means much. Maybe they only went into the estuary.

Anyway, they're certainly good looking and from what I've seen/heard, they're very good fighters, as well.

[bubzilla]

Thanks Darian. I talked with a guy once about fishing the Trinity for browns and he said he did it a lot back in the 70s. Supposedly it was incredible. Guess how they regulate the dam changed things. He was talking about getting HUGE browns in there (well over 10 lbs.) on a regular basis. That would have been pretty nice to go along with a steelhead fishery.

I wouldn't be surprised if there wasn't a lot of scientific information available regarding searun browns on the Trinity--there really isn't much on any run of any fish on any river at this point. We pretty much know jack about anadromous species when you really think about it. Would be cool now since they can make electronics so compact and can track by satellite if they would study where salmon and steelhead go and what they do once they leave the river, for example. Pretty much everything we know in that regard now is an educated guess as opposed to scientific fact.

P.S. if anyone's interested in checking the study indicating that searun cutthroat don't return above the Illinois River on the Rogue, the bibliographical information is as follows:

Tomasson, T. 1978. Age and growth of cutthroat trout, Salmo clarki clarki, in the Rogue River, Oregon. Master’s thesis. Oregon State University, Corvallis.

[Darian]

Ya know,... I'd be willing to bet that even tho there isn't a lot of info about anadromous fish in the public domain, there's probably a bunch in commercial/private hands.... With current commercial satellite and sonar tracking capabilities, that use has got to've come up....

Wow!!! Talk about paranoia....

[sculpin]

Some where in the last 6mo I have seen a picture of a Brown from the coast that was thought to be a sea run. By looking at the picture I would guess the same. It was very bright and clean with only a hint of brown and the red spots. I just can't remember who or where I saw the picture.
Bubz I know we pushed the subject around on Jefferson a while back about the Sea Run Cutts.After reading the paper you refer to about the sciencetific study of their migration ending at the Illinois I still have my doubts. I haven't caught one of the cutts I would call a sea run in years and I would call the ones pictured in this thread residents or whatever that fancy word you used was.The cutts I called sea runs above Gold Ray were super chrome with just hints of spots and I only got them in the summer. The enviroment of the river has changed a lot over the years since the dam was completed maybe thats why I don't pick them up anymore. It would be neat to have a scale sample from one to check out.

Mark