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Thread: Trinity River Steelhead Winter Fishing in Jeopardy

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
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    Sutter Co and the KMP
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    274

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    Quote Originally Posted by Darian View Post
    the TRRP Proposal appears to be based on the assumption that downstream water rights holders (e.g. major valley water contractors/growers/users) won't object or litigate in opposition. After all they've attempted to enforce their rights to water stored in the Trinity drainage in opposition to other projects in the past. Nothing here is chiseled in stone yet. Based on past history not sure I think those users won't exercise their influence/money to try either modify or scrap this proposal.

    Add: the tone of the responses to the original post and the one under the "Conservation Forum" were clearly inappropriate. Hopefully, we can get back to a civil discussion of this topic....
    Darian,

    I can't envision that to be a valid concern. As Redband mentioned this isn't a proposed addition to ROD flows, merely a change when some of those flows are released. No amount of bitching and whining by water interests changes the fact that they lost that battle 21 years ago.

    Releasing water in the winter is something they'd like to see happen IMO because it could under the right circumstances, lead to more actual carry over storage than the current fixed flow hydrographs based on water year designation. Ex: Say we're in a normal water year and they shoot 120k acre feet down the river in the winter during a year when Trinity is at the high end of conservation pool and approaching an elev-temporal flood control trigger point. Releasing that water earlier could prevent that trigger from happening.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
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    Sutter Co and the KMP
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    Quote Originally Posted by ricards View Post
    Thank you all for getting me on track here!

    Let nature do its work during the winter months.
    First, x2 what Redband said.

    That can't really happen in the upper part of the river if the base flow at Lewie is locked at ~350cfs. The science this action is largely supported by is the second to the last source in the link you provided. It's not someihing I'd recommend attempting to read and understand if you've never read any peer reviewed science before, but from the abstract this should be pretty easy to understand:

    "These analyses indicate that warmer water temperatures during the initial time of the ROD-flows would increase the potential for growth and suggest that the warmer water will encourage earlier outmigration. Larger smolt size at time of ocean entry may enhance ocean survival. Water quality issues and risk of parasitic infection increase and may reduce survival later in the summer in the Klamath River. Selective withdrawal from Trinity Lake could provide warmer water temperatures during late April and May."

    Along the lines of what RB is trying to convey 60,000af equals 6.1 days at a constant 5000cfs release. Hardly enough to ruin the winter. However it could become slightly less revisionistic and more true should we ever get a wet or better year.

    All that said, if I had a magic wand that I could wave and make anglers do what you just did (call a CREDIBLE source who forms opinions based on data and science) I'd be waving it like it was a flag on parade day.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
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    On the River in Shastanistan
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    162

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    X2 to what YC said.
    Letting the status quo prevail won't allow Mother Nature to do its work if the flows are locked in at 300 at Lewiston. Mother Nature can't even happen.
    To amplify just one sub-point on the reference that was discussed and YC extracted, the natural temperature profile of the entire river is completely out of synch with Mother Nature (amongst many other issues). The higher flows in late spring/early summer, when they should be much lower, are causing the temperature of the water to stay much too low due to the additional release of cold water. This is turn is affecting smolt growth and delaying the out-migration to the Klamath much later than it should happen. And by the time the out migration happens, water temps in the Klamath are too high and conducive to disease and thermal issues, and they die in large quantities.
    And that's only one small part of the benefits of the new flow regime. To discuss the rest would take pages and pages.

    Quote Originally Posted by ycflyfisher View Post
    First, x2 what Redband said.

    That can't really happen in the upper part of the river if the base flow at Lewie is locked at ~350cfs. The science this action is largely supported by is the second to the last source in the link you provided. It's not someihing I'd recommend attempting to read and understand if you've never read any peer reviewed science before, but from the abstract this should be pretty easy to understand:

    "These analyses indicate that warmer water temperatures during the initial time of the ROD-flows would increase the potential for growth and suggest that the warmer water will encourage earlier outmigration. Larger smolt size at time of ocean entry may enhance ocean survival. Water quality issues and risk of parasitic infection increase and may reduce survival later in the summer in the Klamath River. Selective withdrawal from Trinity Lake could provide warmer water temperatures during late April and May."

    Along the lines of what RB is trying to convey 60,000af equals 6.1 days at a constant 5000cfs release. Hardly enough to ruin the winter. However it could become slightly less revisionistic and more true should we ever get a wet or better year.

    All that said, if I had a magic wand that I could wave and make anglers do what you just did (call a CREDIBLE source who forms opinions based on data and science) I'd be waving it like it was a flag on parade day.

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