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Thread: DAVIS LAKE Car Top Boat launching area closures, Jenkins/CowCreek etc.

  1. #1
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    Default DAVIS LAKE Car Top Boat launching area closures, Jenkins/CowCreek etc.

    Hello All,

    I have made some progress regarding the closure of car top small boat launching closures at Davis Lake. The recent closure of Jenkins point and the scheduled closure of Cow Creek to car top launching by pram, canoe, pontoon boat, kayak etc is still in place and underway. I have been able to communicate through email and miraculously received an email response from the USFS Forest Supervisor Christopher Carlton and we will soon be scheduling a conference call/Zoom with the USFS Beckwourth District Ranger Keli Ward.

    I explained in my email to Christopher Carlton the need for these access points to remain open for car toppers that try and launch various types of watercraft and the need to off load these boats from close to the shoreline such as a 100 pound pram for instance. I tried to explain the need and the use by a large portion of users that are car toppers that launch craft that do not lend themselves to launching from a concrete boat ramp as it takes too much time to offload the water craft and then to unload and load up gear etc.

    If you are a car topper that fishes this lake that launches a watercraft that requires you to pop it off your roof close to the waters edge now is the time for you to contact the USFS and let them know your needs and WHY a spot like Jenkins point and Cow Creek point (or Lightning Tree etc) is important to your safe boating and ability to launch your craft to reach various fishing areas safely.

    USFS Forest Supervisor Christopher Carlton Plumas National Forest has designated USFS Kelli Ward to take input and research the issue. She is the current acting District Ranger for the USFS Beckwourth Ranger District. She and I will be discussing the closures next week. So these are the two people you should be emailing and/or calling. I would strongly suggest a written email. It can be brief. I would suggest you include in your letter.....The type of boat you are launching such as a pram, small john boat or row boat, larger pontoon boat, canoe, kayak and why you need to be able to get your vehicle close to the shoreline to offload your boat (ie my PRAM weighs 100 pounds and I can't drag it 150+ feet to the waters edge....or I am 70 years old and I can not carry my canoe 150+ feet to the shoreline. I would state how these closures impact you directly such as your age ( I am 70 years old and still try to fish but can't drag/carry my pram/canoe/pontoon far, any disability or mobility issues such as knee or hip replacement as an example, I use a cane, I can't walk far, I can't lift or carry a pram/pontoon/canoe very far etc. Also indicate the length of time you have been using Jenkins point and Cow Creek etc and launching at these spots. You can be as brief or as lengthy in your email as you see fit just let them know your view point. Don't be shy, don't be scared to send an email.
    I have received an email response from both CHristopher Carlton and Keli Ward (we are in the process of setting up a day and time to talk/Zoom) and as I stated she has been delegated the assignment of researching this issue on behalf of the USFS and will in turn provide her findings to Christopher Carlton for I assume his final decision. Also make sure you email *both* CHristopher Carlton USFS Supervisor and Keli Ward USFS District Ranger.

    I also would encourage anyone that in general cares about USFS access to make your voice heard even if these closures don't impact you directly such as if you are a float tuber or a power boater for instance. USFS has a bad lengthy pattern of closing off more and more access and areas and opportunities without regard for users this is the chance you get to voice your opinion and let them know your needs and why Jenkins and Cow Creek needs to remain open for use.
    Also please feel free to pass along the below emails and phone contact information to anyone you think may have an interest in access at Davis Lake.

    I think we have a chance here to stop the bleeding before it's too late.....

    GOOD LUCK!!!!
    GOOD FISHING!!!!

    Here is USFS Plumas National Forest, Forest Supervisor Christopher Carlton email and phone number....
    Christopher.Carlton@usda.gov
    p:530-283-7810
    c:530-927-7713

    Keli Ward District Ranger, Beckwourth Ranger District, Plumas National Forest
    Keli.Ward@usda.gov
    p:530-836-7157

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by FREEDOM-FLYFISHER View Post
    Hello All,

    I have made some progress regarding the closure of car top small boat launching closures at Davis Lake. The recent closure of Jenkins point and the scheduled closure of Cow Creek to car top launching by pram, canoe, pontoon boat, kayak etc is still in place and underway. I have been able to communicate through email and miraculously received an email response from the USFS Forest Supervisor Christopher Carlton and we will soon be scheduling a conference call/Zoom with the USFS Beckwourth District Ranger Keli Ward.

    I explained in my email to Christopher Carlton the need for these access points to remain open for car toppers that try and launch various types of watercraft and the need to off load these boats from close to the shoreline such as a 100 pound pram for instance. I tried to explain the need and the use by a large portion of users that are car toppers that launch craft that do not lend themselves to launching from a concrete boat ramp as it takes too much time to offload the water craft and then to unload and load up gear etc.

    If you are a car topper that fishes this lake that launches a watercraft that requires you to pop it off your roof close to the waters edge now is the time for you to contact the USFS and let them know your needs and WHY a spot like Jenkins point and Cow Creek point (or Lightning Tree etc) is important to your safe boating and ability to launch your craft to reach various fishing areas safely.

    USFS Forest Supervisor Christopher Carlton Plumas National Forest has designated USFS Kelli Ward to take input and research the issue. She is the current acting District Ranger for the USFS Beckwourth Ranger District. She and I will be discussing the closures next week. So these are the two people you should be emailing and/or calling. I would strongly suggest a written email. It can be brief. I would suggest you include in your letter.....The type of boat you are launching such as a pram, small john boat or row boat, larger pontoon boat, canoe, kayak and why you need to be able to get your vehicle close to the shoreline to offload your boat (ie my PRAM weighs 100 pounds and I can't drag it 150+ feet to the waters edge....or I am 70 years old and I can not carry my canoe 150+ feet to the shoreline. I would state how these closures impact you directly such as your age ( I am 70 years old and still try to fish but can't drag/carry my pram/canoe/pontoon far, any disability or mobility issues such as knee or hip replacement as an example, I use a cane, I can't walk far, I can't lift or carry a pram/pontoon/canoe very far etc. Also indicate the length of time you have been using Jenkins point and Cow Creek etc and launching at these spots. You can be as brief or as lengthy in your email as you see fit just let them know your view point. Don't be shy, don't be scared to send an email.
    I have received an email response from both CHristopher Carlton and Keli Ward (we are in the process of setting up a day and time to talk/Zoom) and as I stated she has been delegated the assignment of researching this issue on behalf of the USFS and will in turn provide her findings to Christopher Carlton for I assume his final decision. Also make sure you email *both* CHristopher Carlton USFS Supervisor and Keli Ward USFS District Ranger.

    I also would encourage anyone that in general cares about USFS access to make your voice heard even if these closures don't impact you directly such as if you are a float tuber or a power boater for instance. USFS has a bad lengthy pattern of closing off more and more access and areas and opportunities without regard for users this is the chance you get to voice your opinion and let them know your needs and why Jenkins and Cow Creek needs to remain open for use.
    Also please feel free to pass along the below emails and phone contact information to anyone you think may have an interest in access at Davis Lake.

    I think we have a chance here to stop the bleeding before it's too late.....

    GOOD LUCK!!!!
    GOOD FISHING!!!!

    Here is USFS Plumas National Forest, Forest Supervisor Christopher Carlton email and phone number....
    Christopher.Carlton@usda.gov
    p:530-283-7810
    c:530-927-7713

    Keli Ward District Ranger, Beckwourth Ranger District, Plumas National Forest
    Keli.Ward@usda.gov
    p:530-836-7157
    Last year the PNF awarded their concessionaires to Reno-based Outdoors in Plumas (OIP). It immediately became clear that OIP was intent on shutting down access, not only to Lake Davis, but to all outdoor activities, so that people would be forced to use their fee based ramps, campgrounds, and trailheads. Ten bucks for day access to hiking trails is criminal. They do NOTHING to support the PNF and do NOTHING to improve highway pullouts in the Lakes Basin. But they have big signs and iron rangers everywhere. Instead of annual launching permits for Lake Davis, they now only sell annual permits for each RAMP into Davis. It pretty much sucks, but volumes of complaints to the PNF have landed on deaf ears.
    We have approached LaMalfa and his reply is that he has encouraged forest managers to produce revenue at all costs and in any way possible. He is in favor of INCREASING use fees. Until we get a new Congressman, we're screwed.

  3. #3
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    Congratulations! You are the First #1 reply! We have to start somewhere. Thank you very much for the reply and the information.

    I am not aware of this Outdoors in Plumas taking over the concessionaires for PNF. I will google to see if they have a website after posting this reply. Sadly this ultimately is USFS policy that they have contracted out to this OIP business to carry out and do their dirty work. They are the authority here overseeing what is enacted and carried out. Yes this is ALL about $$$$money$$$$ I figured that out 4 years ago with the BS USFS was pulling with the ramps and access to Camp 5 charging just to park there. If I might ask....what is an "iron ranger"?

    I contacted LaMalfa regarding wheelchair user (I use a wheelchair) launching access at Davis/Frenchman's 4 years ago after USFS threw the logs and boulders blocking off the access to launching on the north side of Camp 5 point where it is nice and flat and plenty of area to park and launch and great for me using a wheelchair and he of course blew me off. I also contacted my reps, Cortez Masto, Heller, Amodei, and they all also blew me off. They are all worthless bastards as far as I am concerned. I am in Reno so LaMalfa doesn't represent me so I am not in a position to call upon him for help. I called his office just last week actually and spoke to a nice staffer woman explaining my issue and of course she ultimately gave me they he's not your rep. Their website doesn't even take emails from anyone other than persons in his jurisdiction.

    $10 to go hiking? That's sick. That's disgusting.
    All this is screwing over a lot of people in various ways.
    I am not giving up. I will fight until my last dying breath. I work with the VA Reno and various organizations and on an individual basis introducing severely disabled veterans and persons to fishing/kayaking and opportunities and areas to access to get back out there and resume a normal life after traumatic injury and what the USFS Plumas County is doing to a lot of people is criminal.
    In their recent responses to me they have indicated I am entitled to file a USDA discrimination complaint (which I became aware of 4 years ago) as can anyone with ANY disability or mobility impairment that these closures impact. I couldn't do that 4 years ago when they closed the north side of Camp 5 because there is a 6 month statute of limitations the USDA has on filing a complaint and they closed it off in the fall and I didn't find out until the next summer after they did it. Now that they have recently, this summer closed off Jenkins Point I am (as is anyone else) within the 6 month period and will file a complaint if they tell me to go jump in the lake like they did 4 years ago. I haven't been up there since they enacted the Jenkins closure due to the fires (we half less than 1/2 mile visibility in Reno right now due to the smoke) but I will get up there and take some pictures and video for a USDA complaint.
    Unfortunately, Cow creek closure is coming next. That hurts a lot of people trying to launch and fish safely.

    I don't agree with your assessment that we are screwed (until we/you get a new congressman).
    As far as all the fee BS perhaps but not the access and closures of launching areas such as Jenkins/Cow Creek.
    The USDA discrimination complaint process allows for ANYONE to file a complaint within 6 months. ANYONE that needs those areas to safely launch and safely reach areas that they wish to fish without boating lengthy unsafe distances to access and get to areas a person wants to fish IF they have any impairment or disability that requires them to park close to the water and offload a pram/raft/canoe/pontoon boat/kayak etc. If a person has any medical issue ANY mobility impairment whatsoever such as let's say a hip replacement, knee replacement, age even ( I am 70 and can't drag my pram 100+ feet), any issue along those lines they can file a USDA disability discrimination complaint. If I don't make any headway with the USFS on Jenkins closure in the next few months I will be forced to do that.

    If you (or anyone else) are still willing to go after the Plumas USFS on ALL this BS with Fees and Access closures etc I am all in.
    Let me know.
    Last edited by FREEDOM-FLYFISHER; 08-23-2021 at 09:49 AM.

  4. #4
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    An "iron ranger" is basically a hollow metal pylon with a slot, usually meant for collecting use fees. You have probably seen them at parks and campgrounds, among other places. Just google "iron ranger fee collection" and you will see some images.

    As an aside, I live near a large CA state park with a lot of trails and several trailheads. Day use parking fees are $6 - $8.

    A while back I went mountain biking at Spooner Lake to ride the Flume Trail and NV state parks charged $15 for non-NV residents, $10 for NV residents for parking.

    CA state parks have discounts for disabled, seniors and veterans. I think NV state parks has something similar.

  5. #5
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    Good luck with your ADA quest, but don't expect it to be successful. ADA access does NOT mean that I can launch my boat/pram any where I want. In fact, under ADA guidelines, if you can launch your boat/pram by yourself by dragging it a few feet, you don't qualify for an ADA exemption anyways.

  6. #6
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    Thanks Yep I have used "iron ranger" before, never heard it called that.
    I have no problem paying fees. I have issue with not being able to go fishing ever again at Davis/Frenchman's.

  7. #7
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    I am not interested in launching my kayak anywhere I want....just somewhere on two lakes that had many natural places for decades that have been closed off. The closures of Jenkins and Cow Creek etc don't only impact me but many car top users.

    "In fact, under ADA guidelines, if you can launch your boat/pram by yourself by dragging it a few feet, you don't qualify for an ADA exemption anyways." ....... Post the statute citation number within the ADA that states this, I'd really like to see it, read it.

    That's exactly what I have been doing, dragging my kayak a few feet to launch. I'd like to be able to keep doing that so I can go fishing. Other users would also like to park and offload their water craft at Jenkins/ Cow etc without having to drag a 100+ pound pram 100+ feet.
    Last edited by FREEDOM-FLYFISHER; 08-23-2021 at 06:12 PM.

  8. #8
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    Straight from the ADA: To be protected by the ADA, one must have a disability, which is defined by the ADA as a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more major life activities, a person who has a history or record of such an impairment, or a person who is perceived by others as having such an impairment.

    Like I said, good luck with your quest, but don't expect it to be successful.
    Being able to launch your boat/pram/kayak/whatever wherever you want is not considered a "major life activity" covered under the ADA. And good luck "proving" your disability after being able to launch it from a car top by your self.

  9. #9
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    You are misreading the above quote. A person is disabled under the ADA despite being able to launch a kayak and go fishing. I ski, scuba dive, flown private aircraft, drive a car, etc and the ADA of course applies to me and I am considered disabled due to using a wheelchair despite being able to paddle a kayak and fish or do anything else.

    "Being able to launch your boat/pram/kayak/whatever wherever you want is not considered a "major life activity" covered under the ADA. And good luck "proving" your disability after being able to launch it from a car top by your self.".....<<<<< this is a misunderstanding of the above quote.

    Being able to launch a kayak and paddle a kayak has nothing to do with the meaning of "major life activity" . That term applies to the actual physical or mental disability. Also I do not launch my kayak from a car's top as you said. I pull my kayak out of the inside of a camper van not off the roof which also has nothing to do with being considered disabled under the ADA.
    Last edited by FREEDOM-FLYFISHER; 08-23-2021 at 08:20 PM.

  10. #10
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    My apologies, as I did not realize you were disabled. I now understand your post better. I interpreted your "rant" as another, dadgum gubmint closing down my ability to drive along the lakeshore stopping me from fishin' and I don't care what environmental damage I cause with my truck post. And I agree with you, special needs should be considered in determining vehicle access in environmentally sensitive areas and there must be some way to accommodate this. Again, my apologies for mis-interpreting your post and I do encourage you to pursue this.
    Last edited by WLREDBAND; 08-23-2021 at 09:18 PM.

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