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Thread: Scandi/versileader question

  1. #1
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    Default Scandi/versileader question

    I've only used Skagit heads and sink tips for winter steelhead, for the Klamath this fall I got an Airflo Rage head for mostly dry and barely subsurface fishing...I've never used Versileaders before, and ordered some the other day...the ones I got were by Rio, said freshwater Versileader but had a picture of a Steelhead on the cover. They are 7’ long, 12 lb test, in 1.5 and 3 ips sink rates. However, I also saw this morning that Rio made 10’ Scandi Spey Versileaders that are like 75 grains at 10’. I'm wondering if the ones I got will work OK? Also, for fishing skaters I was just going to build my own tapered leaders if that's cool? Any help is greatly appreciated, I'm use to dredging the bottom in the winter so this stuff is all new to me.Thanks
    Last edited by Jcolin; 08-11-2020 at 08:32 AM.

  2. #2
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    The ones that you bought were designed to be used on the end of a standard single hand trout line to make a sink tip. The Spey Versileader have a stronger 24 pound core and we’re designed to be used with the various Scandi heads. Your Rage head is a Compact Skagit with a built in floating tip. It was designed by Tom Larimer to be used as a “Scandi” but still feel & cast like a Skagit so people didn’t have to change their casting techniques.

    I would exchange the 12 pound test trout for the 24 pound test Spey Versileaders. The heavier cores will give you better turnover in the wind and when using foam body skaters.

    https://www.rioproducts.com/products/spey-versileaders
    Last edited by richr; 08-12-2020 at 07:16 AM. Reason: Added link

  3. #3
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    Hey Richr thanks very much for confirming my mistake...I was fooled by the picture of the steelhead�� will exchange them for the 24 lb core versileaders

  4. #4
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    Rio makes 2 types of Versileaders for us swing guys. I personally use both types depending on the head and weight rod. I use them 75% of the time unless I really need to get down, then I'll bust out the T11,14 Both cast great and work well.

    1) Spey Versileaders 24lb 6ft or 10ft I use the 10ft
    75grains come in float, 1.5ips, 3,4,5,7
    I use the 10ft, fish them on every 2 handed rod I own. Perfect on Scandi body, skagit and can be casted in Scandis with a good caster.

    2) Scandi Versileaders 10ft only
    35grain comes in float, 1.5 ips, 3,5
    I fish these on my trout speys with skagits or scandi body heads. Cast great on any Scandi from Rio and also the new Spey Lites from SA.

    Both versatile sink tips in any swingers tip bag. I typically use the Spey Versileaders in place of T8.

    Hope this helps
    And Always Remember
    Keep Those Line Tights
    Brian W Clemens
    Nor Cal Fly Guides
    530-354-3740
    norcalflyguides@gmail.com
    www.norcalflyguides.com


    "I have many loves and Fly-Fishing is one of them; it brings peace and harmony to my being, which I can then pass on to others."
    ~ Sue Kreutzer

  5. #5
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    This is a tad confusing, as the specs you are describing sound more like the trout leaders as richr is describing, but they are usually packaged with a brown trout on the package? I would agree that those probably wouldn’t be the best match for your Rage head. What grain is that Rage anyway?
    The ones I’ve seen with a steelhead on the package are the ones that Brian is describing, and I concur completely about all of them working well depending on which line you are matching it up with. They both have their places, and I’ve even used the trout ones a few times on light weight Scandi heads.

    I have to say though, if you are talking about fishing in early fall on the Klamath, I would recommend just fishing a straight floating line with a mono leader (doesn’t even need to be anything too fancy, though I do like to start with a good long section of heavier mono to aid with turn over if it’s windy)... I don’t think you’ll need the tips at all personally. It took me a while to wrap my head around it, but summer/fall steelhead are super willing to move to the surface to grab a fly; it’s a big part of what makes that time such a special treat! Some will no doubt point out that there are runs, or pools where a sinking tip will get you more grabs...or that during the middle of the day it’s much harder to get a fish to take a surface or “damp” fly presentation...all true, but there are also plenty of opportunities to fish a floating line with just a mono leader and do very well! When I’m fishing up there in the fall I stick to a full floater about 99% of the time; if I don’t get a grab in a fishy looking riffle that time of year I will usually just go find another riffle, or perhaps make a few more casts with a smaller fly.
    JB
    "Lord help me to be the person my dog thinks I am"
    - unknown

  6. #6
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    I had a 12'6" #6 Spey rod with some kind of a Scandi head.

    Doug Duncan recommended the Airflo Rage head for me because I am an intermediate Spey caster at best.

    The Rage head change my Spey casting a ton.....I love it.

    I am going to say that the Rage head is somewhere between a Skagit and a Scandi.

    The next problem is getting the right weight Rage for your two handed rod.
    Bill Kiene (Boca Grande)

    567 Barber Street
    Sebastian, Florida 32958

    Fly Fishing Travel Consultant
    Certified FFF Casting Instructor

    Email: billkiene63@gmail.com
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    Contact me for any reason........
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  7. #7
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    Thanks guys, Brian ill check out both the scandi and spey versileaders by rio. Jasonb, yeah it was confusing, because i had used the ones with the brown trout on the cover for stripping streamers for trout on my single hand rods, thought i was good to go with the big steelhead pic but i’m guessing its for swinging for SH with a single hand rod maybe? I hear you on the floating line for summer runs, its so ingrained in me to try to get deep for winter fish but its a whole different thing. Last fall hooked a lot of fish with my commando head and tips, but didnt get to skate dries at all and was a bit overgunned with my 12’6 6 weight with the exception of a few nicer adults. My airflo head is 330 grains, will be using it in on an old sage 5120 brownie i found used online. Even treated myself to a new hardy salmon #1 reel to pair it with, looking forward to fishing this combo as ive always used cheaper stuff being young and poor. Thanks again guys for the help

  8. #8
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    Good luck up there. In terms of surface vs tips, do keep in mind that there is still a big difference in terms of a skated fly vs a wet fly just an inch or two under the surface. Lots of fish that won’t quite commit to attacking a skated fly will still hit a wet fly, but I’ve also seen the opposite in some situations where a skated fly will get the attention of some fish that a small wet fly doesn’t seem to interest. Best bet is to fish both options a lot!

    Your set up should work well, just toy around a bit on leader length and stiffness to find what you like best. I’d guess you could start pretty thick with a 390 Rage, if you have leader making options.
    Cheers,
    JB
    "Lord help me to be the person my dog thinks I am"
    - unknown

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
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    Grass Valley
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    You've got lots of good info on versileaders. You just have to experiment but I think with a 330 gr head, the lighter leaders will probably perform fine with a classic summer steelhead type fly. I use both the Airflo 5' and 10' trout on a 260-280 gr scandi head and those leaders should be close to the light Rio versileader.

    I just use a mono leader most of the time in the fall. I like to tie a 12' tapered leader down to about 3x and then put lighter tippet on it as required. Steelhead don't often seem to be very leader shy and usually 3x is good enough. That said, a Versileader or polyleader will give you a bit more stick in your anchor for touch and go style casts. If you're new to single spey and snake rolls, or if you're using a snap T, it may help to start with some sort of poly coated leader.

    Joe
    Last edited by TahoeJoe; 08-14-2020 at 11:36 AM.

  10. #10
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    Great thanks Tahoe Joe. I am new to snake rolls and single speys, really only do snap ts and double speys for my winter fishIng, so expecting to have some trouble getting the hang of it. Will be practicing here on the russian once the summer crowds start to wind down.

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