Spear Fishing

[JCam]

jcam,.... After reading your post, I'm wondering what your statement:

"If you play with ban fire, you are going to get burnt."

Has to do with the discussion in this thread. Please provide an explanation....

If you get to ban something you do not like that someone else does, you concede the right someone else can ban what you like.

[Darian]

If you get to ban something you do not like that someone else does, you concede the right someone else can ban what you like.

OK, I understand. Thanks for the response....

[Rossflyguy]

I would! Because I know the assholes will not be eating them! And that they do it for fun. What do some have such small balls that they have a need to kill on a constant to prove something? I guess to some eating a fish that are 17-25 years old, and full of the worse crap that now fill our water ways; is a thing. I know of some that took big ones and did not eat them. So why kill them if they will not eat them. I dont want to hear the well they gave them to someone else..... Then I have to question the reason behind spearing such big hens!!!

Having had a long talk with Steelie (memeber here) he knows I know the dark side of taking fish. And it’s a scary one!! if I where to discuss it here most would lose their minds!!!! The poaching that goes on is not even funny! Yet some on here want to blame stripers with no FACTS!!! Stop with your damn opinions, and post studies of facts! I sure as hell can post links, but don’t know if it’s worth the time because some will still not see it for what it is. Stripers are the scape goat for why the salmon decline is happening! Yet no mention of damns, and the pollutions that pours directly in rivers from our streets!! Recently saw loads of crap come down some pipes at howe ave area.... 0_o

Pretty sure everyone, including myself, have said dams and water management are the main issue. But you seem to think striper have no part of the issue. There are many links, podcasts, and pictures with bellies full of smolt by biologist/fisherman that say striper are invasive and don’t help native salmonoid populations. Dams in the valley are here to stay. No use debating that. Water management sucks and we need to vite in a better rep to help solve that. I don’t know why everyone one is fixated on a person legally harvesting fish. Would you rather someone buy farmed fish that spread disease to wild fish? Striper are far more abundant than everyone is making it out to be. There aren’t as many large stripers BECAUSE salmon population is down so forage (smolt) items aren’t as plentiful and not to mention the population of fisherman targeting striper.. That’s why stripers are showing up in and above Redding. Trout to feed them and the guides up there are promoting the take home method of stripers there. Barging smolt down past kill zones is imperative. That’s why the Mokelumne has such good returns of salmon the last few years. All the evidence is there. People are just so touchy about stripers. They’re absolutely fun to catch and they’re good to eat. They also fall under the category as invasive by scientific standards. Who cares if a spear fisherman LEGALLY pops one and takes it home or gives it to a friend. Everyone needs to relax.

[winxp_man]

And Ross stripers only became a problem in the late 90’s funny isn’t it!

[Rossflyguy]

And Ross stripers only became a problem in the late 90’s funny isn’t it!

Funny, logging only became a problem in the 70’s. Funny isn’t it.

[John Sv]

Good points Rossflyguy, Walter, and Jcam!
Bans are great when 'your side' is winning, sucky when not! And it's unlikely to run the table of always being on the side you want to be in a ban.
Also as an invasive to CA and a native of the Chesapeake Bay watershed, I can attest that everyone should eat lots of stripers! Agree that the big cows have too much mercury.
PS I may be blending these two threads together.

[Ralph]

y;185207]Pretty sure everyone, including myself, have said dams and water management are the main issue. But you seem to t[QUOTE=Rossflyguhink striper have no part of the issue. There are many links, podcasts, and pictures with bellies full of smolt by biologist/fisherman that say striper are invasive and don’t help native salmonoid populations. Striper are far more abundant than everyone is making it out to be. There aren’t as many large stripers BECAUSE salmon population is down so forage (smolt) items aren’t as plentiful and not to mention the population of fisherman targeting striper.. That’s why stripers are showing up in and above Redding. [/QUOTE]

I don't know of anyone who has studied striped bass impact on the Bay/Delta ecosystem as much as Dr. Peter Moyle of UC Davis - not even close. He would refute just about everything you have said except for the impact of our artificial water regime. His studies, spanning over 30 years, show that stripers eat far more salmon predators than they do salmon. Salmon smolts are in and out of striped bass territory in less than a few weeks as they journey to the ocean. Stripers will certainly eat smolts given a chance, but that window of opportunity is quite small. Pikeminnow, hardhead, and black bass, all salmon smolt predators, must contend with striper predation year round. In the big picture, lack of salmon has little to nothing to do with striped bass. Even during outsmolting, stripers eat more non game fish than salmon. This is a scientifically published and peer reviewed fact, disavowed only by the water agencies. Please point me to any scientific evidence which demonstrate that stripers are the cause of the salmon decline.

[mogaru]

y;185207]Pretty sure everyone, including myself, have said dams and water management are the main issue. But you seem to t

I don't know of anyone who has studied striped bass impact on the Bay/Delta ecosystem as much as Dr. Peter Moyle of UC Davis - not even close. He would refute just about everything you have said except for the impact of our artificial water regime. His studies, spanning over 30 years, show that stripers eat far more salmon predators than they do salmon. Salmon smolts are in and out of striped bass territory in less than a few weeks as they journey to the ocean. Stripers will certainly eat smolts given a chance, but that window of opportunity is quite small. Pikeminnow, hardhead, and black bass, all salmon smolt predators, must contend with striper predation year round. In the big picture, lack of salmon has little to nothing to do with striped bass. Even during outsmolting, stripers eat more non game fish than salmon. This is a scientifically published and peer reviewed fact, disavowed only by the water agencies. Please point me to any scientific evidence which demonstrate that stripers are the cause of the salmon decline.

That's absolutely correct. Stripers predation on salmon smolts is seasonal and therefore minimal. The rest of the year they feed on crayfish, bass, shad, smelt etc, etc, and after over a century is California have certainly being "naturalized" and are part of the ecosystem. Of course the water guys have them on their list to demonize and target. Years ago they try to remove the size and limit and now they are being targeted by allowing spearfishing in freshwater.

[Sheepdog8404]

y;185207]Pretty sure everyone, including myself, have said dams and water management are the main issue. But you seem to t

I don't know of anyone who has studied striped bass impact on the Bay/Delta ecosystem as much as Dr. Peter Moyle of UC Davis - not even close. He would refute just about everything you have said except for the impact of our artificial water regime. His studies, spanning over 30 years, show that stripers eat far more salmon predators than they do salmon. Salmon smolts are in and out of striped bass territory in less than a few weeks as they journey to the ocean. Stripers will certainly eat smolts given a chance, but that window of opportunity is quite small. Pikeminnow, hardhead, and black bass, all salmon smolt predators, must contend with striper predation year round. In the big picture, lack of salmon has little to nothing to do with striped bass. Even during outsmolting, stripers eat more non game fish than salmon. This is a scientifically published and peer reviewed fact, disavowed only by the water agencies. Please point me to any scientific evidence which demonstrate that stripers are the cause of the salmon decline.

So what your're saying then, Ralph, is that we really need to be throwing more Pikeminnow, Hardhead and Bass patterns than rainbow/smolt patterns for Stripers???

[Ralph]

So what your're saying then, Ralph, is that we really need to be throwing more Pikeminnow, Hardhead and Bass patterns than rainbow/smolt patterns for Stripers???

A chartreuse Clouser imitates all of the above. Or none of the above.