Drifting the Mokelumne (sea lion free?)

[Rossflyguy]

By this idea you would need to "bonk" all american river steelhead.... Just sayin. 0_o

I do unless they have an adipose. Just sayin.

[FattMerro]

As someone who is fairly new to fishing the lower American river (7 steelhead cards reported, and zero steelhead over 5lbs caught in that whole span of fishing the AR), I'm completely torn on this argument that seems to come up more and more often. I don't think I'm alone in that feeling either.

I'm obsessed with Steelhead, and I want a healthy local river. What to do? To bonk or not to bonk? I guess I'll grab the popcorn and sit back.

[Jeff F]

As someone who is fairly new to fishing the lower american river (7 steelhead cards reported, and zero steelhead over 5lbs caught in that whole span of fishing the AR), I'm completely torn on this argument that seems to come up more and more often. I don't think I'm alone in that feeling either.

I'm obsessed with Steelhead, and I want a healthy local river. What to do? To bonk or not to bonk? I guess I'll grab the popcorn and sit back.

That debate will never end, and probably deserves it's own thread. But the way I see it, the American is screwed up beyond repair with regard to re-establishing the original wild fish runs and numbers. And the hatchery ain't going away, so there will always be interbreeding between "wild" fish and pellet-eaters. So, since the river is already completely jacked up, I say the more steelhead in there the better. That's why I don't kill any steelhead.

Just think how many more fish would be in that river, and all rivers, if every single fish were released.

[Morgan]

That debate will never end, and probably deserves it's own thread. But the way I see it, the American is screwed up beyond repair with regard to re-establishing the original wild fish runs and numbers. And the hatchery ain't going away, so there will always be interbreeding between "wild" fish and pellet-eaters. So, since the river is already completely jacked up, I say the more steelhead in there the better. That's why I don't kill any steelhead.

Just think how many more fish would be in that river, and all rivers, if every single fish were released.

I agree! But we all know that is too good to be true.

[cdevine]

I fish quite a bit and try to give honest and accurate feedback. The fish I caught were all wild resident rainbows with adipose fins. I didn't catch any hatchery fish returning. Bummer. Wish I had. With all the pressure these rivers get I just am a firm believer in C&R. Not because I fly fish and its cool and trendy. But I would rather they be long term and sustainable fisheries.

Oh well, like I said before its a nice piece of water that is fishing pretty well, but I would avoid weekends. Not really my cup of tea but its close for many to wet a line so I can see the appeal. If you have a kayak or pontoon its a nice float.

[winxp_man]

I do unless they have an adipose. Just sayin.

I don’t know if it’s possibe to go back in time. But the native wild fish that existed at one time on the American River, don’t any longer. If I’m correctly remembering (and after discussing this issue with a buddy) I had read some article dated 1920’s and titled reintroducing steelhead in the American river. Yes it’s that far back when the American had steelhead problems. The toll that mining took on the America river back in the mid to late 1800’s is irreversible! And the steelhead that once where native are gone. There for if you take the idea to bonk all the fish on the America that are hatchery.... well they are all hatchery breed fish.

Like this year I have not seen so many different types of steelhead trout, and rainbow trout. So many different looks on what is in the river it’s not even funny. Point being the more fish at let go the more diverse the gene pool becomes in my opinion. But to each their own. But again to Say bonk harchery fish, you would need to bonk the hole damn river.

[Rossflyguy]

I don’t know if it’s possibe to go back in time. But the native wild fish that existed at one time on the American River, don’t any longer. If I’m correctly remembering (and after discussing this issue with a buddy) I had read some article dated 1920’s and titled reintroducing steelhead in the American river. Yes it’s that far back when the American had steelhead problems. The toll that mining took on the America river back in the mid to late 1800’s is irreversible! And the steelhead that once where native are gone. There for if you take the idea to bonk all the fish on the America that are hatchery.... well they are all hatchery breed fish.

Like this year I have not seen so many different types of steelhead trout, and rainbow trout. So many different looks on what is in the river it’s not even funny. Point being the more fish at let go the more diverse the gene pool becomes in my opinion. But to each their own. But again to Say bonk harchery fish, you would need to bonk the hole damn river.

Law states wild fish are to be let go. How are you going to determine if a wild native steelhead decided to swim up the American instead of a coastal river? You don’t know. You can only assume. Also, how much different genetically are the steelhead in the sac than the American, Feather, or Yuba? I’m sure they’re all the same since those rivers are basically tribs off the sac river and fush have been tracked to frequent all three. So how do they know for a fact the steelhead that originated aren’t the same ones in the sac river or the Lower Yuba or the Feather? Hatchery fish come from a wild source right? Coleman hatchery steelhead seem to be thriving better than the eel strain in the sac valley rivers. So you’re idea that wether they’re clipped or not they’re hatchery doesn’t quit add up. Too many variables would say different.

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

Seems like the lower Moke, Yuba, Feather and Sac have a population of wild native Rainbow trout.

Lower American River gets very warm late Summer / early Fall, especially during a drought.

[winxp_man]

Law states wild fish are to be let go. How are you going to determine if a wild native steelhead decided to swim up the American instead of a coastal river? You don’t know. You can only assume. Also, how much different genetically are the steelhead in the sac than the American, Feather, or Yuba? I’m sure they’re all the same since those rivers are basically tribs off the sac river and fush have been tracked to frequent all three. So how do they know for a fact the steelhead that originated aren’t the same ones in the sac river or the Lower Yuba or the Feather? Hatchery fish come from a wild source right? Coleman hatchery steelhead seem to be thriving better than the eel strain in the sac valley rivers. So you’re idea that wether they’re clipped or not they’re hatchery doesn’t quit add up. Too many variables would say different.

Dude let’s agree to disagree. Fact is there is no such thing as wild native fish on the American. Fact is that in the 1950’s the Eel River strain was introduced. Fact is that letting them go will increase numbers regardless of what you want to think. I remember when in the same damn river you can catch quite a few fish (regardless of size of river because it’s been the same since 1955) in these drought years and low fish years “bonkig” them will not freaking help. But hey you are entitled to your own opinion. And the “law” does state that you can keep “hatchery” fish. I’m done discussing with you. Tight lines and keep on bonking I guess.

[Rossflyguy]

Dude let’s agree to disagree. Fact is there is no such thing as wild native fish on the American. Fact is that in the 1950’s the Eel River strain was introduced. Fact is that letting them go will increase numbers regardless of what you want to think. I remember when in the same damn river you can catch quite a few fish (regardless of size of river because it’s been the same since 1955) in these drought years and low fish years “bonkig” them will not freaking help. But hey you are entitled to your own opinion. And the “law” does state that you can keep “hatchery” fish. I’m done discussing with you. Tight lines and keep on bonking I guess.

So if a coho runs up the American it’s not native? Even if the American is a historic spawning ground for coho? You’re pretty closed minded. Fish choose rivers most suitable. Not all fish spawning in a river originated from that river. That’s how genetics become diversified. The “fact is” it isn’t so cut and dry like you think it is. Unless you have data that natives no longer reside in this river it’s just an assumption. Wild Native steelhead do run in the American. Not the numbers the hatchery fish have but they do. Even if they hatched from a different water source. That’s why the adipose law is in affect. Just like they run up the Lower Yuba with NO hatchery. I’m gonna bonk as many fish as I legally want. Taking fish doesn’t mean you’ll have less fish returns. I don’t know if you know this but they live in the ocean most of their life. Ocean conditions play a far bigger factor than taking a couple fish from a river system. You’re also giving the word “native” a different definition than it really means. The Hatchery for the American is using NATIVE Californian steelhead to stock the river because of poor spawning habitat. They aren’t dumping non native fish. Any river that has access to the ocean can have any steelhead born in any river run up and spawn in it. That’s a fact.