Pegging beads...more controversial than pineapple on pizza???

[Rossflyguy]

I'm not sure why you would expect me to lobby to make something illegal that is already illegal. There is no debate regarding the definition of snagging, and DFW has made it abundantly clear that fishing pegged beads is snagging. In the scheme of things flossing is so far down the list of things wardens have to worry about that I wouldn't expect them to go out of their way to bust guys snagging with beads nor does it bother me as much as you apparently think it does. You asked for my opinion and I gave it to you. I'm sorry you can't grasp the idea that ethical considerations are the basis for much of our hunting and fishing code known as "rules of fair chase."

To give examples other than snagging, you can't shoot ducks from a moving boat, chum for trout, bait bear, or shoot deer behind a spot light. None of these laws are based on biological reasons, they are based on the rules of "fair chase" as sportsmen have devised them over the decades. Most of us get it.

No where in DFW regs say pegged beads or using beads is snagging or illegal. Definition of a snagged fish is hooked anywhere BUT inside the mouth. So if your stonefly nymph was eaten head first by a smaller fish and hooked on the outer lip, by YOUR statement, that’s considered snagging. Fish get hooked inside/outside the mouth, top of the lips, in the face, etc. It all depends on the size of the fish, how they take it, and the presentation. I’ve caught fish on pegged beads and it always hooked them through the lip of their mouth if it wasn’t a big enough fish to take the whole setup. Some people need to loosen up. This fish took the bead. DFW is more interested in people snagging fish who aren’t eating/striking the lure/bait presented to then. If you’re that much of a “purist” stop using dyed UV materials and go collect your own materials in the woods.

[Siskiyoublues]

Article 1. 2.00 (b) b) Snagging is prohibited. Snagging is defined as impaling or attempting to impale a fish in any part of its body other than inside the mouth by use of a hook, hooks, gaff , or other mechanical implement.

(c) It is unlawful to kill, or retain in possession any fish which has not voluntarily taken the bait or artificial lure inside its mouth.

Not trying to disagree with you, just seeking clarity.
When you are fishing beads aren't you attempting to hook the fish inside their mouths?
I think it's fair to say far more fish that eat a bead are hooked inside the mouth instead of outside.
Is it an issue of trying to prove intent when it comes to determine if someone is snagging or not?
I think it's fair to say there are odd instances where I have hooked fish outside of the mouth using every technique and it was never my intent.

[Rossflyguy]

Not trying to disagree with you, just seeking clarity.
When you are fishing beads aren't you attempting to hook the fish inside their mouths?
I think it's fair to say far more fish that eat a bead are hooked inside the mouth instead of outside.
Is it an issue of trying to prove intent when it comes to determine if someone is snagging or not?
I think it's fair to say there are odd instances where I have hooked fish outside of the mouth using every technique and it was never my intent.

Exactly. I think this is more of a “purist” opinion more than common sense. If this was really an attempt to snag than guides would be using it and risk losing they’re guide license.

[cdevine]

I fish a lot quite frankly. I wish I fished more. Ha ha. I've met some of you and others I haven't. For the most part I think 99% of the people on this board go above and beyond to do the right thing. Gregg is one of them. Calling somebody or something unethical for fishing a bead when its legal is a tad extreme. Everybody is entitled to his/her opinion though. BTW, the wardens I've met are looking for people intentionally breaking the law and doing so in a way it benefits them and harms something or somenbody else. Most of the time this involves harvesting fish or illegal hunting kills. Somebody who is pegging a bead fishing C&R is doing neither. Do I peg beads? I did in Alaska about a decade ago but it got so silly I switched to a flesh fly pattern to try and keep my skills somewhat sharp. Locally I've used a few different winter type designs. The most recent was introduced by LCO owner George Revel. Here is a pic of a fish I got on it last week on the EW. Right in the lip!! Not deep.

tight lines and get out there!

[mogaru]

I'd love to see some pictures of fish caught on beads...........as a matter in fact I'm going to use some today to catch me a toad......Pleaaaaaase someone show some pictures of fish hooked with beads............beads, beads, beads rock. I want some beads for christmas.........

[cdevine]

Couldn't agree more. The only dead fish I saw on the EW are the perch that get blown thru tunnel and don't do well in the 40 degree water. I hate golf because of the snobs. Fly fishing unfortunately has a similiar stigma at times. Just fish. Share what works and try to help others. Challenge yourself to get better. Easy formula.

[johnsquires]

Seems to be one of those areas where civil discourse often goes by the wayside. Personal preference and one's interpretation of regulations play into this. Also, I feel that when someone is asked to give a differing opinion, does so, and then is put down for doing so, that, in my opinion, is not a very productive way to debate such issues.
There is an interesting undercurrent of what constitutes fly fishing (not to mention what constitutes pizza). I don't pretend to have the definitive answers (except on pizza, I do have the definitive answer on pizza), and, though I'm not a fan of beads, I wouldn't attempt to force my opinions on others, as long as what they are doing is legal. I've used beads twice in Alaska and, although it was extremely effective, I'd rather fish with other methods. But that's just me. I do see/have seen where others enjoy beading.
For the life of me, though, I can't understand someone putting ketchup on a hot dog.

[Gregg]

So I genuinely love these kinds of conversations. I’ve said it before, friction is what builds ideas and I think it’s perfectly fine for people to go after eachother a bit...as long as it’s all for the goal of understanding or broaching ideas. I’ve been called a “pompous a**hole” (asterisks because now that word is civil) in the past and I’ll be called one in the future, I don’t get hurt feelies about it or hold grudges or anything. All that being said, I’m at Glenshire right this second and we’re crushing them, mostly on rubberlegs but a few have come on the bead, and lo and behold...the hook somehow magically wound up on the jaw or just inside. I’ll try to take a close up pic if I get another one. Who knows, “haters will say it’s photoshopped” maybe...?

A buddy did get a really solid one on the rubberleg a minute ago, will throw up some pics this eve. Go get ‘em. Work the super slow froggy water and hang on, there’s some big dogs on the prowl.

Thanks for the kind words btw everyone (Cdevine & more), very appreciated

[cdevine]

Awesome work Gregg! Can't wait to see the pics. As everyone knows you work for them on the Big T. And it got chilly the last 2 days...

[bigfly]

When I was little...I wanted fish.....it didn't matter how I did it.....I wanted fish.
So I used bait, and when that didn't work....M80s and 1/4 sticks did.....(think small Kansas crk, not trout waters....)
As a grown up, I like a little more challenge....if grenades were legal I wouldn't fish them now...
I apreciate a challenge. I suspect just hooking up after a while may get dull if it's too easy........but then you can go for most fish ever caught in a day by a right handed white boy.....switch to left hand for an easier record....say 342 trout handled in a day without a shocking device.........
Your face on a Wheaties box...and bead sponsors too...(salty old guy)

People ask me why I don't guide AK.
It's because I have spent years learning bugs...I would be bored to tears just catching fish on beads.
Stupid easy might be the best term for younger guys to understand......and why guides use them....clients want a fish...
many without much fishing background....

Seems logically, if there is no challenge, how much gratification can there be?
Ya caught a fish on a bead woohoo......
Was it pink or blue?
Old guys might refer to it as respect for our sport?
But nevermind....I don't intend to change minds...especially when it seems it was brought up to stir the pot, without a chance of your being convinced otherwise....did you bring this up once before?
It's very rare in my world to hook outside the mouth. And for me....that's the deal breaker...we call that foul hooked, or not fairly caught.....I know...who decided what's fair?....Decades of sportsmen.
Why do you think we fish barbless?
I don't think beads will go away till they change the regs.......and I doubt that will happen....since consumers like them, even if shop people don't. ..
But I'd rather take up self dentistry than fish beads.
If you wonder why guys just swing instead of bobber fish? It's because the outcome is even less likely....
Why on earth would somebody make this sport harder? Because it's more sporting and way more challenging....
And logically...more satisfying....


Jim