Folsom Lake rising much faster

[Idadon]

Interesting discussion, this "Spawning Fish" talk. Here's an opinion from Idaho. THEY ARE ALL SPAWNING FISH!!! They wouldn't be in the river if they weren't trying to spawn. The only exception is "Half-Pounders" and "Jacks" and maybe they think they get to spawn too. It's all a matter of degree. Fishing Redds is just wrong but on the practical side all of it of it, swinging, nymphing, lining or throwing bait is all fishing for spawners. Make your peace with the fact that even hooking a fish and fighting it is interfering with its spawning effort even if you respectfully release it.

Having said the above, am I going to stop chasing Steelhead? NO! It's a lot of fun. But I will say this; I'll stop fishing for Steelhead if everyone else does.

[Morgan]

I realize that there really are no truly WILD steelhead in the AR.

That doesn't prevent me from respecting the fishery as a whole.

When I catch a fish (adipose clipped or not) if I intend to release it, I want it to survive... thus I don't take it out of the water. If it's trying to spawn, I don't fish for it. I don't use methods which allow me to catch the same fish multiple times such that I put undue stress on the fish and reduce its chances of survival and reproduction.

Whereas, we will never have a sustained population of naturally-spawning fish on the American River, the ones hatched in the river do tend to fight better than those raised in the hatchery thus I believe it's important that we anglers do all we can to promote that by not fishing the redds.

Finally, steelhead which get long-lined, flossed, or have a hook, line, sinker or fly hit them in the ass, fin, body... tend to get spooked and become reluctant to grab a legitimately-presented; fly, lure, bait.

Steelhead, whether wild or hatchery-raised, are magnificent creatures worthy of respect and good sportsmanship by those who pursue them.

Well said bud!

[winxp_man]

I'm not even fishing for steelhead anymore..... I'm fishing for the fish of 1000000000000 casts Hahahaha! Who said 1000 cast is a bit wrong hahaha!

[Jeff F]

Aaaah, the steelhead board rears it's ugly head again. Shocker!

I usually stay out of these types of threads, but I gotta chime in on this one. The post about the fathers teaching their kids to "target" steelhead is what always brings me to the point of barfing. The perpetuating of this practice from father to son, generation to generation, is the hardest thing to swallow. I've seen it first hand on the American too many times to count. Yes, these are hatchery fish, but they're spawning IN THE RIVER. They're not in the raceways at the hatchery. These fish are making little steelhead for all of us to catch in the future.

On another note.......Let me ask you this......

When you're fishing the American, or any other river with hatchery fish (Trinity, Klamath, Feather, Yuba, etc, etc), does it piss you off when you hook a clipped fish? Do you toss it up on the bank like a squawfish or sucker? Does it really ruin your experience? When you're fighting that big hatchery disaster that has you into your backing, are you not stoked? Really? I doubt it......

Yes, the American is not the Mattole. But just think for a moment about the number of steelhead that would be in the river if people released ALL of them, clipped or not. We fish the American to catch steelhead. It's never going to be a wild steelhead river. But when people bitch and moan about the lack of fish in the river, you need to ask yourself, why am I out here on the river? Should I really be teaching my son to snag fish just so I can bring home a piece of meat to the wife and show her how macho I am? Or do I want my son to realize what awesome creatures these are, to respect them, and preserve them, and maybe he can go out next time and catch more? And his kids will have a chance to catch them?

Just think about how cool it is to have a nice sized steelhead on your line, clipped or not. It freaking rules!

[Yuba rainbow]

Aaaah, the steelhead board rears it's ugly head again. Shocker!

I usually stay out of these types of threads, but I gotta chime in on this one. The post about the fathers teaching their kids to "target" steelhead is what always brings me to the point of barfing. The perpetuating of this practice from father to son, generation to generation, is the hardest thing to swallow. I've seen it first hand on the American too many times to count. Yes, these are hatchery fish, but they're spawning IN THE RIVER. They're not in the raceways at the hatchery. These fish are making little steelhead for all of us to catch in the future.

On another note.......Let me ask you this......

When you're fishing the American, or any other river with hatchery fish (Trinity, Klamath, Feather, Yuba, etc, etc), does it piss you off when you hook a clipped fish? Do you toss it up on the bank like a squawfish or sucker? Does it really ruin your experience? When you're fighting that big hatchery disaster that has you into your backing, are you not stoked? Really? I doubt it......

Yes, the American is not the Mattole. But just think for a moment about the number of steelhead that would be in the river if people released ALL of them, clipped or not. We fish the American to catch steelhead. It's never going to be a wild steelhead river. But when people bitch and moan about the lack of fish in the river, you need to ask yourself, why am I out here on the river? Should I really be teaching my son to snag fish just so I can bring home a piece of meat to the wife and show her how macho I am? Or do I want my son to realize what awesome creatures these are, to respect them, and preserve them, and maybe he can go out next time and catch more? And his kids will have a chance to catch them?

Just think about how cool it is to have a nice sized steelhead on your line, clipped or not. It freaking rules!

To answer your question no I don't get pissed off hooking up with a hatchery fish its fun but then again I also don't get pissed off hooking up with a sucker or squawfish it's all fun. But I do realize that squawfish and hatchery fish are not good for wild populations of steel head in general. Why toss a native squawfish on to the bank are they not cool enough? I just don't get the point of arguing over hatchery fish. That's why I probably won't even fish the American this year. The view points are so much different here than my home by the deschutes everyone there is all about taking hatchery fish out of the system if caught.

[winxp_man]

To answer your question no I don't get pissed off hooking up with a hatchery fish its fun but then again I also don't get pissed off hooking up with a sucker or squawfish it's all fun. But I do realize that squawfish and hatchery fish are not good for wild populations of steel head in general. Why toss a native squawfish on to the bank are they not cool enough? I just don't get the point of arguing over hatchery fish. That's why I probably won't even fish the American this year. The view points are so much different here than my home by the deschutes everyone there is all about taking hatchery fish out of the system if caught.

I think there is a misunderstanding in this thread. I see what you are saying YR but the statement your making is better said towards rivers that are far better in shape to sustain big numbers of salmon and steelhead. The AR works in major part because of the hatchery. This river could not work on its own. Think about the facts! Its only 23 miles or so!!! And to add on top there is no tributaries where the salmon or steelhead could spawn. So in all this can the salmon, steelhead, stripers, shad, sucker fish, and squawfish all make it just fine in a river with only so much water especially with the recent drought years? So with that said US locals that can not fish a river thats well off compared to the AR would like to go out once in a while a get a fish on a fly. Not everyone can take a trip to the North Coast or in OR or WA. And its why some on here are of the idea that the river from sunrise up should be closed to fishing so the snagging, linning and so on could stop. So a stop to the unethical way of fishing could help a bit with the numbers of fish in this river.

The most recent one I have seen is a fly bobber guy got a buck about #8-10... Lands it about 15 minutes later. Then proceeds and takes it out of the water then looses grips with the fish and flops it on rocks a few times, and all this while is called over another fishermen to take a pic of the fish. Then goes over and drops it in the river without at least even checking to see if it could swim on its own. To me this is all due to education. Most of the people I speak to I tend to touch bases on the subject of landing and releasing a fish. EDUCATION IS THE KEY in my books to making for a better person or fisherman with ethics.

So all in all The lake sure is coming up with water! And recently got a #4-5 Chromie-Wan-Kenobi

[EricO]

"Chromie-Wan-Kenobi"

Lol, I'm gonna borrow that.

EO

[Troutsource]

A few days ago I actually saw a guy, supervising his 8 year old kid and holing a spinning rod, and THROWING COBBLES AT SPAWNING STEEIHEAD.
Grant

According to the great Jim Teeny, "You stone 'em, you own 'em." He throws rocks in the water (or at least he used to) to find the steelhead (by watching them move), and claims that they'll still hit a fly even after this occurs. I ran into him once on the Green. Here was this mutant just pulling in big rainbows hand over fist at the put-in. He was swinging one of his Teeny Nymphs in some shallow water and I couldn't believe how many fish he was hauling in. This was during a cicada hatch. The he introduced himself and gave us each a few of his flies (I think I read somewhere he tried to patent them). A consummate self-promoter. I tried them a few times on the A and actually had some success. Which gives me an idea...

Below is a picture of a Teeny Nymph.

[Idadon]

Hey, those things catch fish. Tied with a bead and fished during a caddis hatch they can be deadly, at least on the Henry's Fork. Caught some Steelhead on the Gualala on one of these tied with green dyed pheasant tail. Really easy to tye too.

[Yuba rainbow]

I think there is a misunderstanding in this thread. I see what you are saying YR but the statement your making is better said towards rivers that are far better in shape to sustain big numbers of salmon and steelhead. The AR works in major part because of the hatchery. This river could not work on its own. Think about the facts! Its only 23 miles or so!!! And to add on top there is no tributaries where the salmon or steelhead could spawn. So in all this can the salmon, steelhead, stripers, shad, sucker fish, and squawfish all make it just fine in a river with only so much water especially with the recent drought years? So with that said US locals that can not fish a river thats well off compared to the AR would like to go out once in a while a get a fish on a fly. Not everyone can take a trip to the North Coast or in OR or WA. And its why some on here are of the idea that the river from sunrise up should be closed to fishing so the snagging, linning and so on could stop. So a stop to the unethical way of fishing could help a bit with the numbers of fish in this river.

The most recent one I have seen is a fly bobber guy got a buck about #8-10... Lands it about 15 minutes later. Then proceeds and takes it out of the water then looses grips with the fish and flops it on rocks a few times, and all this while is called over another fishermen to take a pic of the fish. Then goes over and drops it in the river without at least even checking to see if it could swim on its own. To me this is all due to education. Most of the people I speak to I tend to touch bases on the subject of landing and releasing a fish. EDUCATION IS THE KEY in my books to making for a better person or fisherman with ethics.

So all in all The lake sure is coming up with water! And recently got a #4-5 Chromie-Wan-Kenobi

Yes it is a small system and I agree that's why they have the hatchery. But it still doesn't bother me having people keep fish. The hatchery puts out plenty of them into the river especially because of how small and drought ridden it is. There are plenty of fish for such a small system. And those hatchery fish don't just affect that system. My pal caught a big hatchery fish up on the yuba that he kept and it had tons of juvenile wild rainbows from the yuba.