Red-Truck fly Rod's & reels

[Walter]

The only problem with custom rods or home made rods or imported "shop rods" is down the road, who will warranty them if they break?

If these shops or rod builders go out of business then nobody will stand behind these rods.

There are a few long term reputable custom rod builders like Gary Anderson of Anderson Custom
Rods and Jim Clarkston of Raptor Rods who will warranty their rods.

If the rods are on close out prices then that is different. It is worth the risk.....

If you are spending much money for a good fly rod I would stay with companies that have been around a while and hopefully will be there when you break it.


Many guides, especially new ones, will use what ever rods that companies will give them free.

ost of the top guides will be using Sage which are not free but at a good price to top guides.


We have had many people over the years come in with fly rods that not only don't have anyone to warranty them, you can't even get parts to fix them. Then they are not too happy......



.

Bill Kiene I respectfully disagree. The bigger companies like Sage, Loomis, etcerera are so expensive because they originally billed in the cost of a replacement into the original purchace price because the warranty was originally free back in the day. And now that its not did they lower the purchase price? No. The price of the warranty repair is going up and the only way the cost of the rod is going down is because those companies started allowing cabelas and such to sell their products, which screwed fly shops.

I will say that other than the old Sage XP, the only rod I like better for steelhead is the Red Truck 1953 8 Weight. Takes me a few years to beat the hell out of the line guides. I prefer the stiffness in the lower part of the blank but the medium action in the tip. Fast Action rods are for wind, bobber or people who cant cast. I fish shooting heads, the 1953 launches them, and its wonderful to fight fish. I've caught hundreds of steelhead on the Red Truck 1953. Its a great rod. And I havent been into Lelands for over a year and over a year before that. Im not a homer commentator.

Oh yeah, and I think you can buy three Red Trucks for one Sage Loomis Loop Beulah, etc...

Hows that for warranty repair?

[Carpe Vino Cass]

No disrespect was intended towards Bill Kiene or anyone at the Kiene shop just because we commented on a non-traditional brand, but either this forum is a free exchange of ideas and information or it’s just another censored advertisement for a single corporate interest, and I'd like to think that’s not the case. Just my $.02

[Darian]

the title of this Forum. That title doesn't imply that products to be reviewed are limited to brands that Kiene's American Fly Shop sell and past threads have covered products not, generally, held in inventory there. So, no need to take this discussion to another BB or blog.

Bluegrass Bill asked for information about anyones experience with a RedTruck rod, a rod that he had used himself on a guided trip and liked it. Meaning no disrespect to Bill Kiene, IMO, his post wasn't responsive to BB's question; more a caution about avoiding imagined issues with low end products by upgrading to high end products. No problem with that but, also, no problem with countering either (no insult intended....).

[Walter]

Yes, no direspect at all. I just think if you run a retail shop, which Bill no longer does, a 30% markup on a Sage over a cheaper rod equals more revenue to the Retail Shop. Rents are high. It makes sense to promote the more expensive product, if the manufacturer doesnt have you under contract to sell nothing else but their product(or bully you into it) and allow pittance for a margin. Now that the big companies allow their products to be sold by big box stores and have moved production out of country they dont deserve the higher margins they keep for themselves and dont share with the Fly Shops. Fly Shops go out of business when they cant make anything on the items they are able to sell. One reason Ive always liked Bills Shop was the diversity of equipment, tackle and fly tying materials. Many Shops couldnt continue that practice, lost foot traffic and couldnt pay their rent. That and fly fisherman, long time fly fishermen, are cheap as hell, in my experience. Or stubborn and dont buy new gear.

[aaron]

Yes, no direspect at all. I just think if you run a retail shop, which Bill no longer does, a 30% markup on a Sage over a cheaper rod equals more revenue to the Retail Shop. Rents are high. It makes sense to promote the more expensive product, if the manufacturer doesnt have you under contract to sell nothing else but their product(or bully you into it) and allow pittance for a margin. Now that the big companies allow their products to be sold by big box stores and have moved production out of country they dont deserve the higher margins they keep for themselves and dont share with the Fly Shops. Fly Shops go out of business when they cant make anything on the items they are able to sell. One reason Ive always liked Bills Shop was the diversity of equipment, tackle and fly tying materials. Many Shops couldnt continue that practice, lost foot traffic and couldnt pay their rent. That and fly fisherman, long time fly fishermen, are cheap as hell, in my experience. Or stubborn and dont buy new gear.

There's not a single brand in the industry contractually bullying their dealers thankfully. And your operating margins are a fair bit off.

[Dan LeCount]

I just make my own at this point.

[Bluegrass Bill]

Hi folks,

First thanks to all for your comments and recommendations, all very good points to consider. It was never my intention in any way for this topic to insult Bill or any of Kiene’s Fly shop staff or products.

I have been a loyal customer of Both Kiene’s and American Fly Fishing (before the merger) for over 30 years buying more than 90% of my fly fishing equipment (rods, reels lines, waders, fly tying etc.) from one of these stores. I have been and am friends with most of the staff at Kiene’s.

With the merger I will continue to support Kiene’s just as I always have. That does not mean I will never consider a certain item elsewhere that really catches my eye.

Thanks again for your comments and suggestions, my apologies if anything I said was taken the wrong way or as it appears may have led to something taken in an unintended way. As with any diverse group we all have opinions and are free to agree or disagree.

I hope to see some of you at Kiene’s November 19th when the next opportunity for the Western Lights Trio to perform comes about with a special Thursday night Simms event. And here is a little tune to lighten the mood. Tight lines to all!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XmEzTlaZMA
Northern California Fly Fishing Blues!

Bluegrass Bill, long time Kiene and American Fly fishing company supporter.

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

Imported fly rods are a great deal and good value.

If you check my post for the last 10 plus years you will see me recommending them for most.

Actually, I would recommend you buy an imported fly rod from top companies like Orvis, TFO or Redington so in the future when you break the tip it can be repaired under warranty.



If you can afford a Sage fly rod then I highly recommend that you buy one or several.


If you think that these imported rods are better than a Sage then you know very little about this subject.

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

Imported fly rods are a great deal and good value.

If you check my post for the last 10 plus years you will see me recommending them for most.

If you buy an imported fly rod I would get one from a top companies like Orvis, Echo, TFO or Redington so in the future when you break the tip it can be replaced under warranty.

__________________________________________________ ______________________________________________

If you can afford a Sage fly rod then I highly recommend that you buy one or several.


If you think that these imported rods are better than a Sage then you know very little about this subject.

__________________________________________________ ______________________________________________

[Walter]

You dont have to have a contract to be bullied or threatened with having the line pulled from you. And it has and does happen. Ahem, Simms anyone?

And Im saying the retail shop should be allowed a 30% margin, and are not because the manufacturers are taking everything they can. Standard retail markups should be 30% over cost from manufacturer or distributor. Fly shops are getting high-balled, if you will. Fly shops started trying to shake it up a bit just in time for companies like Sage to let Cabelas have at their line, undercutting the fly shop business. If you want to support your local fly shop you would not buy from Cabelas.

In my opinion, Leland was tired of the game and tried to do their own thing, hence Red Truck Rods. And if I can catch hundreds of steelhead on the rod and enjoy my time with it who cares if its not a fancy expensive rod?

You can you an AR-15 with a crazy scope to shoot a deer ten miles away(joking) and you can use a lever action Iron sighted rifle and sneak up on the deer. It doesnt matter what you have its how you use it. Of course if your $18 dollar ebay rod breaks when you cast it from an actual flaw, that sucks. But one of the best flyfisherman Ive ever seen with my own eyes uses $18 ebay specials. And he catches more fish than the next 50 guys combined. He is proud of the rods and shows them off.