Spear Fishers on the American river

[Mark V]

Yesterday morning fished the American river with a friend and had a good time with over 50 dinks to the boat; only one was near 18"er. Then around 10:30a we came across 2 guys snorkelling & spearfishing just downstream of the "golden gate" bridge below Howe Ave.

Couldn't see if they were carrying spears, so asked one guy, "Do you have a spear?" He said yes, so I mentioned about the County regulation against bringing a spear on the bank. He acknowledged he knew about the Reg, and said he didn't want to have the conversation, so he then would not answer when asked several times where did he park?

As the boat drifted downstream and my friend cast for more stripers, called the Rangers (875-7275) on my cell.. hit "1" to report a crime or request a Ranger. It rang off the hook with no answer! Several times the next 20 mins. Bummer. Maybe was naive to believe their office when they said they will enforce against that.

In hindsight, maybe I shoulda let him know my boats a jet, so no propeller... and then buzzed that side of the river section a few times to spook any big striper hens.

Heads up some spear guys are illegally working the American. I plan to follow up with the Rangers office until I get through.

[Tony Buzolich]

How bad does this have to get before anyone takes action? Mark, I applaud you for trying to get through to the "Rangers" but maybe it's time for a real vigilante squad of volunteers to" take up arms" so to speak. Those of you who fish the American regularly ought to be first in line and have that phone number as a part of their cell directory. Why not call the "regular" police department as well to report a crime? Maybe they can get through to the ineffective rangers. Maybe the Sacramento be ought to be made aware how ineffective both the rangers and the police are in NOT taking action?

I can assure you guys up this way would have run over or shot folks spearing anything in this area and they would be supported by the local authorities.
Tony

[Mark V]

Tony, Thanks for the empathy.

Yes lets spread the word and be vigilant as a community, report it and try to get enforcement. I hope no one will take the V word too far.

Didn't think to call the reg police, but I believe that would be the Sac Co. Sheriff, and anyone who's reported a grand theft to SCS in the last few years knows how under-staffed/ -funded they think they are.

My buddy I was fishing with said I should be careful not to be too confrontational near those guys cuz you never know how truly crazy and reckless they can be. Packing guns?

I guess briefly breaking the 5mph speed limit on the river is about as far as I'd go to blunt the lawlessness of spearfishers. A pacifist at heart, but sure there was anger in my voice yesterday, and I def coulda been craftier with my words and tone, maybe try to convince them that law is enforced and not cheap..

[Mike O]

How bad does this have to get before anyone takes action? Mark, I applaud you for trying to get through to the "Rangers" but maybe it's time for a real vigilante squad of volunteers to" take up arms" so to speak. Those of you who fish the American regularly ought to be first in line and have that phone number as a part of their cell directory. Why not call the "regular" police department as well to report a crime? Maybe they can get through to the ineffective rangers. Maybe the Sacramento be ought to be made aware how ineffective both the rangers and the police are in NOT taking action?

I can assure you guys up this way would have run over or shot folks spearing anything in this area and they would be supported by the local authorities.
Tony

Wow. Run over or shot people pursuing a legal fish in a legal manner. A fish.

[O.mykiss Hunter]

Yeah, I'm with Mike O on this one. I don't like the idea if spearfishers in the American, but retaliating with violence seldom leads to good results. In my opinion no fish is worth that level action.

[Mark V]

The SpearFisher clearly knew he broke the county law against bringing the spear to the banks of the river. That's not persuit in a legal manner--period. He clammed up when asked where they parked-- further evidence of consciousness of guilt.

Persuing a fish is different from taking steps to annihilate a population of sportfish in the region. Taking out super breeder hens like shooting them in a barrel in the American effects numbers of generations of stripers in the American and the Sac river, and the Feather, etc. Lets be clear these guys are not bright, or selfish or both.

Mr. Buzolich expressed a natural reaction to this calculated illegal activity, much like I did with my language on the water, but I noticed he did not directly call for shooting or running over any of said nice ppl.

Let's focus on being vigilant, and unified about putting pressure on Sac Rangers to enforce their laws as they said they would. Also, getting DFW to change that nasty Reg allowing SF'g in the clear water rivers.

[Lew Riffle]

Do follow up. Discipline your emotions into dogged persistence. Find out why you could not get a response from law enforcement. Next time be ready by already having talked to law enforcement. Follow these guys and a least get the observation of what they are doing wrong for a citizen report, where they are getting in the river, parking, vehicle description and license number.

[MendoFish]

He acknowledged he knew about the Reg, and said he didn't want to have the conversation, so he then would not answer when asked several times where did he park?

That's probably because he wanted to continue fishing and not deal with any drama while he's trying to enjoy himself, much like you would if someone came up to you harassing you while you were lawfully fishing.

In hindsight, maybe I shoulda let him know my boats a jet, so no propeller... and then buzzed that side of the river section a few times to spook any big striper hens.

While I appreciate you making it known that you aren't trying to physically hurt or kill someone, you are going to violate the law over this?
2009. (a) A person shall not willfully interfere with the
participation of any individual in the lawful activity of shooting,
hunting, fishing, falconry, hunting dog field trials, hunting dog
training, or trapping at the location where that activity is taking
place.
(b) A violation of this section is punishable pursuant to
subdivision (b) of Section 12000. (c) Any person convicted for a violation of this section that
occurred within two years of a prior violation of this section which
resulted in a conviction is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by
imprisonment in the county jail for a period of not more than one
year, by a fine of not less than one hundred dollars ($100) and not
to exceed one thousand dollars ($1,000), or by both imprisonment and
fine.
(d) This section does not apply to the actions of any peace
officer or personnel of the department in the performance of their
official duties. This section does not obstruct the rights and normal
activities of landowners or tenants, including, but not limited to,
farming, ranching, and limiting unlawful trespass.
(e) In order to be liable for a violation of this section, the
person is required to have had the specific intent to interfere with
the participation of an individual who was engaged in lawful
shooting, hunting, fishing, falconry, hunting dog field trials,
hunting dog training, or trapping.
(f) For purposes of this section, "interfere with" means any
action which physically impedes, hinders, or obstructs the lawful
pursuit of any of the above-mentioned activities, including, but not
limited to, all of the following:
(1) Actions taken for the purpose of frightening away animals from
the location where the lawful activity is taking place.
(2) Placing or maintaining signs, gates, locks, or barricades that
prohibit or deny access to lands without authorization from the
landowner or lessee or an authorized designee of the landowner or
lessee.
(3) Placing food on lands not belonging to the person placing the
food for purposes of eliminating the lawful ability to hunt due to
the presence of bait, as defined in this code or regulations adopted
pursuant to this code.

12000. (a) Except as expressly provided otherwise in this code, any
violation of this code, or of any rule, regulation, or order made or
adopted under this code, is a misdemeanor.
(b) Notwithstanding subdivision (a), a person who violates any of
the following statutes or regulations is guilty of an infraction
punishable by a fine of not less than one hundred dollars ($100) and
not to exceed one thousand dollars ($1,000), or of a misdemeanor:
(1) Section 2009.
(2) Subdivision (a) of Section 6596.
(3) Section 7149.8.
(4) Sections 1.14, 1.17, 1.62, 1.63, and 1.74 of Title 14 of the
California Code of Regulations.
(5) Sections 2.00 to 5.95, inclusive, and 7.00 to 8.00, inclusive,
of Title 14 of the California Code of Regulations.
(6) Sections 27.56 to 30.10, inclusive, of Title 14 of the
California Code of Regulations.
(7) Sections 40 to 43, inclusive, of Title 14 of the California
Code of Regulations.
( Section 251.7 of Title 14 of the California Code of
Regulations.
(9) Sections 307, 308, and 311 to 313, inclusive, of Title 14 of
the California Code of Regulations.
(10) Sections 505, 507 to 510, inclusive, and 550 to 553,
inclusive, of Title 14 of the California Code of Regulations.
(11) Section 630 of Title 14 of the California Code of
Regulations.

How bad does this have to get before anyone takes action? Mark, I applaud you for trying to get through to the "Rangers" but maybe it's time for a real vigilante squad of volunteers to" take up arms" so to speak. Those of you who fish the American regularly ought to be first in line and have that phone number as a part of their cell directory. Why not call the "regular" police department as well to report a crime? Maybe they can get through to the ineffective rangers. Maybe the Sacramento be ought to be made aware how ineffective both the rangers and the police are in NOT taking action?
Tony

I wonder if the rangers don't respond well because no laws are being broken? Are you going to actually tie up PD so they can't respond to real emergencies over this? A court case has already been won, confiscated gear returned and no fines issued.

I can assure you guys up this way would have run over or shot folks spearing anything in this area and they would be supported by the local authorities.
Tony

What an absurd thing to say. I can assure you as can any police officer or lawyer that you will not be supported. If you attempt to cause great bodily harm to me or another dive buddy I will respond by defending myself against great bodily harm in accordance with California Penal Code 240/PC242. I wish you no harm and would like it if you left me alone. If you threaten me be prepared for the consequences. Do you really want to risk losing your life over a fish? I sure don't want to end up in court with your next of kin suing me regardless of my walk in criminal court.

Yeah, I'm with Mike O on this one. I don't like the idea if spearfishers in the American, but retaliating with violence seldom leads to good results. In my opinion no fish is worth that level action.

Thank you, glad someone doesn't have the mindset of a lawless criminal.

The SpearF-er clearly knew he broke the county law against bringing the spear to the banks of the river. That's not persuit in a legal manner--period. He clammed up when asked where they parked-- further evidence of consciousness of guilt.

Persuing a fish is different from taking steps to annihilate a population of sportfish in the region. Taking out super breeder hens like shooting them in a barrel in the American effects numbers of generations of stripers in the American and the Sac river, and the Feather, etc. Lets be clear these guys are avid morons, selfish bstards or both.

Mr. Buzolich expressed a natural reaction to this planned illegal activity, much like I did with my language on the water, but I noticed he did not directly call for shooting or running over any of said aholes.

Of course he stopped talking, as did I when I was approached. The conversation is going to lead nowhere positive and I don't need to waste my time conversing with someone with bad intentions when i'm trying to lawfully fish. It IS pursuit in a legal manner(can't speak for everyone there, but there are ways to stay within the law and shore dive) As mentioned before, a court case has already been won and set. As far as annihilation-means of take has NOTHING to do with conservation. Most spearfisherman (or spear F'ers as you so maturely put it) are very conservational. Spearfishing is no "nasty reg" and is done in a multitude of states.



Bottom line- Are you really going to act like low life criminals and harass/assault/batter someone who is lawfully (or even if someone wasn't for that matter) fishing? After my incident with people in your mindset I now carry my phone with me while diving so I CAN call police when someone tries to "run me over" or assault me.

It's going to be pretty entertaining the day you guys end up harassing or assaulting a diver who ends up to be a police officer. It shouldn't be a surprise that some law enforcement dive.

I don't want to deal with harassments or threats to cause me great bodily harm.In fact, I don't want to deal with anything but what I came there for, I just want to fish. You can kick and scream all you want but it sounds like you are just going to have to learn how to share. Much like your mother taught you when you were 2 (or apparently didn't). It amazes me people can get so upset over a means of take they are willing to violate the law or harm someone else.

[Mark V]

MendoFish,

Hope you weren't offended by an abbreviation of spear Fishers--guess you must be one of those Catch N Release spear guys!

Ok, I apologize for the sarcasm. No need for this to turn into a big pissing contest. If you really are conservation minded, can we talk about that?

Do you really think that most spear Fishers are very conservational? What specific steps do conservation-minded spear Fishers take to protect and enhance the populations of stripers in our rivers?

I wouldn't harm or threaten bodily harm to one of the takers, period.
You gave a lot of detail on CA codes about interfering with legal fishing. If you're a conservationist at heart, are you going to say that the guy who knowingly breaks the law that prohibits him from bringing the spear to the park... is legally fishing while he's in the river?

Please provide more detail about the court case you mention. The details of the case will be important to the conservation discussion.

I confess to selfishly enjoying the tug of stripers so much it makes me upset to think about even a few super breeder hens being "taken" in clear water, because I know that means the striper population in my backyard American river (and Sac, Feather, Yuba) will continue it's trend-- and that is, I'm sorry--nasty.
Nutshell that's what conservation means to me.

In plain words, what does it mean to you?
If you're a conservationist, let's turn this into a positive discussion we can all agree on, and start developing a plan to work together to protect and turn around the striper populations in our rivers.

[MendoFish]

MendoFish,

Hope you weren't offended by an abbreviation of spear Fishers--guess you must be one of those Catch N Release spear guys!

Ok, I apologize for the sarcasm. No need for this to turn into a big pissing contest. If you really are conservation minded, can we talk about that?

Do you really think that most spear Fishers are very conservational? What specific steps do conservation-minded spear Fishers take to protect and enhance the populations of stripers in our rivers?

Catch and release- Very funny. I can be selective, if I don't want to "release" a fish, I simply don't shoot it or handle it period. Very similar to H&L guys choosing what they want to keep only I don't have to handle and release dozens of fish I don't want. I can choose to pass 20 schoolies, a hen, or take one single one that I want.

Conservational- Yes. You may be surprised at the amount of time some divers take out of their personal lives to attend various meetings- Watermans Alliance, CSBA, DFG etc. I will confess I haven't been to one in a while due to moving. We have been trying to organize a day we can get everyone together to leave the spears at home and spend the day cleaning up the underwater trash dump that is the AR.

I wouldn't harm or threaten bodily harm to one of the takers, period.

Good. There is no reason to make things violent over a fish, disagreement, or anything else related to this. I wish more people felt that way.

You gave a lot of detail on CA codes about interfering with legal fishing. If you're a conservationist at heart, are you going to say that the guy who knowingly breaks the law that prohibits him from bringing the spear to the park... is legally fishing while he's in the river?

As i'm sure you know, any navigable waterway is not part of the parks system and therefor not illegal to travel through with a weapon.

As for entering the parks system- I can't speak for every person there but how I would enter would not classify what i'm carrying as a weapon. As I said, there are ways to enter without violating that law.