Need help with Skagit Cast

[flyaster99]

I have some problems with my Skagit cast in terms of the loop formation. Instead of a single loop, my cast some how has a "double loop" as shown in this photo :


It is only rarely that I can achieve a clean single loop like this, and even so, its looks like there is a tendency for the line to form a 2nd loop :


What might be the problem? I am quite conscious to maintain a smooth and even casting stroke and try not to over-power the rod to minimise tip bounce. Can any-one advise what might be the main case of this problem? I am quite sure that this is robbing my cast on distance, accuracy and presentation. Any advise, comments and critique will be much appreciated.

I know I should arrange a few sessions with an instructor, but unfortunately, the closest Spey instructor is 20 hours flight away from where I live...

Here are some video footages on my casting stroke for your reference :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxuc...GOIdRnqmjuVxdg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvYz...GOIdRnqmjuVxdg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qx3s...GOIdRnqmjuVxdg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3tv3...GOIdRnqmjuVxdg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6_i...GOIdRnqmjuVxdg

Thanks in advance.

[TaylerW]

Break your cast down into every step. Start with your anchor set. Then your sweep and d loop. Then your underhand pull and forward stroke. One thing that can cause you issues is not having a smoothe stroke as you come from your anchor set, to your d loop. Smoothe circular motion is key

[Rick J]

it is hard to see in the photos but if what you are describing is a tailing loop then that is typically caused by hitting from the top - that is accelerating too quickly - that initial kick forward motion will cause the rod tip to bend deep and then if you letup at all it will un-bend.

The most obvious thing I pick up on in watching the videos is you are raising too high - using too much hand/arm motion and too much top hand - you have a pretty hard push with the top hand. With Skagit, especially with the short heads, it requires very little hand/arm motion to launch. Your top hand should rarely if ever rise above your shoulder. The best advice I can give to folks who do this little rod kick/rise at the end is to keep your elbows tight against your sides for the entire casting stoke. If your elbows are tight to your side during the sweep, that will limit how high your top hand goes. On off-shoulder as seen in your video, your top hand should come up and hit your left shoulder. Your wrist should be relatively straight and locked. With your elbow of your left hand tight to your side and top hand wrist straight - this will keep you from trunking and dropping the rod behind you. The forward stroke should just be guided by your top hand and the power is the pulling with the bottom hand into your gut. A really important part of the off shoulder cast is that both hands need to travel in a straight line path in relation to each other and in the direction of the target. The most common fault I see is that on the forward stroke a caster will have a tendency to pull that bottom hand across his body ending it in his middle or back on his right side. This will cause the line to go out in a curved path with little power. Both hands need to travel straight path in line with the target - the top hand moving toward it and the bottom hand pulling away from it. A lot to think about and confusing to try and explain with words but hope this helps.

All this being said, your casting is really quite good and results in very fishable casts!!!!

Best,
Rick

[James C]

Definitely hitting from the top. You're punching the rod and line forward with your top hand and then making a crisp stop. That's why you're getting a nice wedge with that "second loop". I'm not sure I'd agree that when using skagit heads that you can't raise your hands. I think that's an individual preference, but I could be wrong.

I'll tell you two important things that turned my casting around. They may seem unrelated at first, but are very important.

1. If you start the cast, no matter what cast or style of casting, with the top hand dominating the cast, then your forward stroke will be dominated by the top hand. Begin your C-Spey, and all your casts, with your bottom hand only. Lock that top elbow in place and don't move it. Add a little bit of body rotation and you will be amazed at how better and easier your casts will work.
Start with your bottom hand, so your forward stroke starts with your bottom hand.

2. Lift is crucial and usually low on the priority list, because we're busy working, and hurrying, on to everything else. Lift the rod, with the bottom hand. Get that line off the water, even if you pause at this point and I often do when I'm casting a single spey. Especially with your Single Spey and C-Spey. It's crucial. Once you begin to realize the benefits of the lift, it will aid in the rest of your cast. A good lift will literally slow you down.

[Terry Thomas]

Those casts will get the job done. In the first shot it looks like you didn't finish your sweep and lifted too soon. The 4th shot looks good. Slow it down and work on the bottom hand.

[Rick J]

I found some clips to reinforce the minimal effort and keeping inside the box without raising much above the shoulder. I have been very lucky to have had the opportunity to learn skagit from three of the best Skagit folks out there. Mike McCune has the least motion of anyone I have been around - it is essentially effortless - take a look at these two clips

[flyaster99]

Thank you all for all the pointers. I will work on my upper hand... or rather get my upper hand to work less. It might take some practice to erase muscle memories from 25 years of single handed casting.