Respectfully....

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

"Can't we all just get along?"

-Rodney King

__________________________________________________ _____________________

Just being funny....sorry.

OK, I think taking down dams would have the most impact on the steelhead ecosystems.

Why, because in my lifetime that is what I think did them all in.

Let's focus on one thing at a time.

We know there are some dams that may never come down but many are all filled in and useless now.

Then people talk about all the silt....well if the dam doesn't come down there will never be any fishery.

Also hatcheries have proved to be harmful to wild stocks of Steelhead.


Get the dams and hatcheries off a few select rivers and see what happen in 10 to 20 years?

I would go for closing those rivers for a while too.

[jbird]

01troutnut.

I agree with everything you said. our young generation (say 28yrs and under) is infintily more lazy than the preceeding generation. There are obviuosly exceptions. It has nothing to do with them being too busy due to a tough economy. Frankly, most of them dont want to work...REALLY work. Its a "Less work for more money" generation. A truly hard days work is a nightmare for most of em. And this goes right along with rolling up your sleeves and fighting for whats important.

...And the next generation will be infinitly more lazy than this one...

[TaylerW]

being a young person, i really take offense to the fact that some of the old guys here are calling MY generation lazy. sure some of us arent go getters but you really have to think of where we learn our work ethic from and get our ideas. one way or another it is all passed down from those who influence us, example being out parents, athletes and other large scale people that are looked up to.

not trying to sound preachy but if you dont train a dog not to bark its gonna bark. just like if you dont train a child to be a productive member of society theyre not gonna turn out well.

so before someone goes off calling us lazy, i would like to see them examine the generation preceeding us and look deeply.

just my .02

[Darian]

It's almost always a losing proposition to label any particular group of people one thing or another. In Jay's defense, he sees things from the perspective of a home builder/contractor who relies on hires he makes daily (if I recall correctly). However, that appears to be a situation localized to south/central Oregon.... If what Jay faces is all one sees, it becomes easy to draw a conclusion that those he has to work with are lazy.

On the other hand, there're many younger people, especially here in Sacramento) who try to work hard everyday in construction related activities but have been laid off and can no longer find work. Large building projects have been extremely slow for some time now and housing tracts that lay unfinished and idle are everywhere.... Handymen have become numerous and are working for some very low prices.

At any rate, I'm still not going t agree that an entire generation is this or that....

[BillB]

Curiously enough there are currently several research studies on generational behaviors. Seems much of the research begins with us old "boomers" and concludes with "Generation Y" or, as some refer to them, "Millennials". It does make for some interesting reading. It doesn't rank up there with fishing but interesting never the less!

Darian has a point in that it is a loosing proposition to label a group with generalizations, as witnessed earlier in this thread. Seems that labeling has a tendency to raise the affective filter and suspend constructive communication.

I am prepared, as a "Boomer" to take my share of the responsibility for "the destruction". But at the same time I am willing, and able, to try and correct our mistakes by donating, both time and dollars, to conservation groups, "voting" for wildlife, and volunteering for Trout in the Classroom. I suppose that could be related to an old "Boomer" saying, "Put you money where your mouth is!"

[aaron]

This thread makes me exceptionally angry.

[jbird]

being a young person, i really take offense to the fact that some of the old guys here are calling MY generation lazy. sure some of us arent go getters but you really have to think of where we learn our work ethic from and get our ideas. one way or another it is all passed down from those who influence us, example being out parents, athletes and other large scale people that are looked up to.

not trying to sound preachy but if you dont train a dog not to bark its gonna bark. just like if you dont train a child to be a productive member of society theyre not gonna turn out well.

so before someone goes off calling us lazy, i would like to see them examine the generation preceeding us and look deeply.

just my .02

You are exactly correct. we reap what we sow. I didnt say my generation isnt lazy (40+) Im just saying from my observation the younger generation has a much higher percentage of lazy "members". I will also admit my generation and the one before me has a lot of stereotypical "problems" too. I'll probably admit to every one of em you can come up with, Ill probably deny that I fit the profile tho. I mean, take one look at the politicians in office around our country. Most of them are of the older generation and most of them are badly misguided....sowing and reaping....

Just for the record, darian is correct, Im a contractor and Im sick and tired of kids who dont wanna work. "Gimme more money and I'll work harder." "No, work harder and I'll give you more money".

[Ed Wahl]

This thread makes me exceptionally angry.

Sorry Aaron, I think that was the ultimate design.

Walter, my hat's off to you.

You've "innocently" stirred up quite a s storm.

You roped me in, as well as many others who are cagier than me.

I am humbled.

Well done sir.

Respectfully....

Ed

[BillB]

How right you are jbird! When I look at the politicians in this country and realize they fall in an age group that generally surrounds me. I find it hard to believe that seemingly educated people can think and say some of the things I observe! I am often embarrassed "for them"! But then it takes more than boomers to elect them!

[wjorg]

Its nice to have a controversial thread that isnt censored. Again, 01troutnut or "whoever you are", I was not blaming "old people." However, it is a fact that the salmonids have almost gone extinct under "their" watch. Thank you for sharing your input. You will help fashion a positive future for those who read your good words.

FYI, I am not on facebook. I believe it to be an IQ test. I am glad Darian has already made a good post about the generation gap. My best fishing buddies are over 60. I treasure my experiences with them.