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Thread: The jurgler prototype, a weedless up-side-down bass bug

  1. #11
    Join Date
    May 2006
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    Lodi, San Joaquin Delta
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    751

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    First Lee, the foam ends about 1/4 inch before the hook tip and since it's soft foam compresses very easily, much easier than a mono hook guard. I don't think the foam will cause a hooking problem. The ice chenille underneath really takes up no volume so the foam and chenille do not really block the gape of the hook. As tied, there's lots of space between the shank and hook tip to get a hookup. If the foam was hard foam I think it would be a real problem though.

    Darian, the bend in the hook was really arbitrary and I just tried to match the KD Mouse. I think the fly could be tied with a lot less bend and still work. The only time I can get the fly to land improperly is when I throw it into my Koi pond by hand. When actually cast at the end of a fly rod I've yet to have it land wrong. The hook by the way is a EC 253. The amount of bend is obviously something to play with.

    NEW: Darian, I tied another, this time bending the hook only half way, leaving half of the gape exposed. It made no difference, the fly turned over just as well and again without fail.

    Both Lee and Darian. I have NEVER been impressed with the hooking power of bend backs but it seems the logical thing to do to make this fly work. I agree with both of you, the less bend back necessary, the better.

    Hairstacker. since you are THE PRO tier in this group, I know you can make it better! There are flies and then there is art. Mike's flies are truly art!

    Sturmer, my patron, my mentor! If this fly can be improved to be half as effective as your bluegill, it will revolutionize top water bass fishing.

    Sculpin, don't get too excited. This is NOT a wake fly for steelhead!

    I played a little with the fly last night. I tied thread about 2/3 down the buck tail on both sides, segmenting the "legs" and then hit the joint with a drop of crazy glue. The buck tail really took on the look of a pair of frog's legs. In addition, once saturated fully, the rear of the fly dropped down in the water until it hung on the foam at about 45 degrees in the water. It really looked like a resting frog. once stripped, it came right up to the surface as a frog does when swimming.

    Obviously what the fly needs next is some field testing. As they say, it's a tough job but someone has to do it!

    open sourcing... I thought it would be fun to have a group develop a fly or flies. The guy proposing the original design gets to name it but individual tiers would get credit on the tying page for the mods and improvements. I could put a section on my website for open source flies with all the details. Building web pages is kind of a hobby for me so unless overwhelmed, no big deal.
    Capt. JerryInLodi
    www.DeltaStripers.Com

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Tracy, CA
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    3,341

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    Hairstacker. since you are THE PRO tier in this group
    Jerry, I truly appreciate the very nice comment but I would be full of it if I didn't heartily object -- Lee is actually the only real PRO in this discussion that I'm aware of and, having seen flies tied by the rest of this group, I would consider myself just another tyer. Thanks again for the kind thought though.
    -- Mike

    Chuck Norris has already been to Mars; that's why there are no signs of life.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Lodi, San Joaquin Delta
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    Lee, if Hairstacker qualifies himself as "only another tier" in this discussion and yeilds to your prowess, I'm in heady company indeed. I feel like a paint by number guy in a gallery of French impressionists!
    Capt. JerryInLodi
    www.DeltaStripers.Com

  4. #14

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    Hey Jerry,

    Like most of the others, I like the looks of this fly a lot . I will definitely tie some up and look forward to trying some. I am definitely getting itchy to get out there.

    Bill
    Bill Ward, ie, Bluegrass Bill, Sacramento, CA
    Guitar Player for Western Lights Band
    Bluegrass and Beyond!
    http://westernlightsband.com/

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    San Andreas, Calif.
    Posts
    196

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    Hey Guys,

    This board is loaded with very talented fly tyers.
    There have been some excellent ideas, and innovations presented here, and I certainly don't want to discourage anyone from tying, testing or changing any design. My tying mentor always cautioned me that, "every pattern can be improved upon in some way".

    The creative aspect of our sport is very personal, and there are really no bad ideas-only ideas that might need to be modified. If we post fly designs here I would hope we would be open to some form of critical analysis.

    FYI:
    When I am working on a new pattern, I have a list of very tough criteria that drive every design. This keeps me from being swept away by a "good looking" bug or fly.
    My list looks like this: the fly must swim right, doesn't foul or spin when cast, cast well on a rod no bigger than an 8 wt., interest fish, hook and hold fish, is tied as simply as possible with readily available material, is durable, and last but not least-appeals to the eye. For me, no fly or bug is a winner until is passes all of these criteria! (i.e. If I am going to tie tarpon flies I, or someone, had better be fishing the design for tarpon BEFORE I proclaim the design a success!)

    On my bench I have many cups full of idea-flies and bugs that remind me how few ideas really make the cut. No matter how cool it looks, if it fails one of my criteria, I must be willing to walk away from the design, or at a minimum, change the design. The last thing I need is to let my ego defend a bad design.

    Sorry for the long post.

    $.02
    Lee

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Sacramento
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    7,786

    Default Criteria!!!!!

    Lee,... That's about as good a summary of what every fly tier should have at their desk as any I've seen. If I'd approached fly tying with those criteria in mind, I probably would've saved a lot of hooks, materials and money over the years....
    "America is a country which produces citizens who will cross the ocean to fight for democracy but won't cross the street to vote."

    Author unknown

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
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    Fresno, CA
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    Darian,

    Your flies should be arriving today or tomorrow

    Jay

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
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    Tracy, CA
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    My list looks like this: the fly must swim right, doesn't foul or spin when cast, cast well on a rod no bigger than an 8 wt., interest fish, hook and hold fish, is tied as simply as possible with readily available material, is durable, and last but not least-appeals to the eye.
    Darian, I totally agree -- I think I'm going to glue Lee's list to my fly tying station!
    -- Mike

    Chuck Norris has already been to Mars; that's why there are no signs of life.

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