The sensitivity of detecting grabs when nymphing

[Adam Grace]

What tools do you guys use to detect grabs when nymphing?

Please share with us your favorite style of indicator and brand if you use indicators, and elaborate why you like that style. Also, if you do not use indicator please join in and tell us about your experiences.

The most common "tool" to detect strikes when nymphing are indicators. Indicators don't always indicate every grab, just like James was commenting about on the tippet "thread." I think that a large majority of use fly fishermen miss many strikes that we never saw or realized we missed. It happens to me all the time. Technique is critical when nymph fishing when you cannot see the fish grab your fly. I refer to the old adage "10% of the fishermen catch 90% of the fish."

I think that that is very true, unfortunately I'm part of the other 90% :lol:

[Adam Grace]

I really like using the "Stri-King" indicator from Spirit River when deep nymphing. They float well and are easy to attach to my leader. The foam post shows me if I am drifting too fast or too slow. I treat my yarn with floatant and they comb it out to make if float higher and longer.

If the water is shallow I will high stick nymph w/o an indicator. For deeper water I use an indicator.

What do you use?

[SteelieD]

Good one Adam. I'll be following closely!

I chose Yarn Indicator because that is what I've primarily been using, however this summer my bro in law turned me on to the pinch ons which I really liked. The only thing about the pinch ons is that they seem to a lot harder to actually determine if there is a strike in faster water. Also, changing depths is not quite as easy. That said, I will probably be using them more and more. I do like high sticking w/o an indicator, I'm just not that good at it! :(

Oh yeah, one other thing, pinch ons seen to be the most common form of fly fishing trash I see. Be sure to put 'em in your vest when you are done! I'm sure we all do here.

[sculpin]

I use yarn because that's all I can see very well fishing into the sun. I comb it out and attach it with a rubberband made from small surgical tubing and put a good glob of jell floatant on it. Actually Bubzilla showed me this method. I hate casting it because it is a lot like casting a foam coffee cup , but it works very well.

Mark

[mems]

Aloha in the salt I think a barracuda would try and eat the indicator. I go naked. I look at where the leader meets the fly line and when it goes tight I set the hook. Funny Adam should ask, cause it was tough to get him to see when a bonefish hit his line, but he finally got one! Mems.

[dtp916]

I have always enjoyed fishing nymphs, under the impression that the majority (80 - 90%) of trout food is below the surface. After watching several (correct that, MANY) fish take my nymphs and get no reaction from my indicator, I began to think my indicator set up over... :roll:

I have used every type of indicator out there. Currently I've been using the frog hair type. They are working out great for me, other than that they have a one time application. Hart's River detectors are another favorite, but they are hard to cast and kink your leader. They are great in fast water, which is what guide Ron Hart designed them for. It also hold your fly at a 90 degree angle, which I am told provides better strike detection.

I'm going to have to say a big Stimulator dry with a BH nymph dropper is my favorite. Easy to cast, easy to watch, and you get hits on the dry sometimes. But you can't get very deep with this set up. This is good in slow water.

I find most people using yarn, which sinks on me. Then it feels like I'm casting a gob of algae. :? :? While at the shop, Jeff told me how to treat the yarn so it won't do that, but I have yet to try it.

[Eyecatch Tinytrout]

I use a hard foam indicator because it's so easy to move up and down the leader and it stays afloat so well. But it does dissapear in deep glare, which is a drag. However, I'd love to hear more about how other fisherman go without an indicator at all. I'd love to have that skill but I'm currently using the indicator as a crutch- I can't do without it!

[k.hanley]

Say Hey Adam,
I couldn't vote since you don't have the two techniques that I use.

I prefer to use a very small piece of flyline coating as an aid in bite detection. I use an old floating line for the material. I simply take a piece of the old line and slightly score the coating. Slip off the coating and cut it in pieces of approximately 1/4 to 1/2 inch in length. Slide the indicator line onto your tippet and it rests on the junction knot beteen tippet and leader taper. It doesn't hinder casting. The aid sits low on the water. It doesn't create unwanted drag during your presentation. It reacts to subtle pressure. It's perfect for me.

Sometimes I'll use a two-fly rig. The "indicator" is a Caddis or Stone dryfly.
Cheers, Ken

[Langenbeck]

I use glo bug yarn that I comb out. Build my own as I go to a plumbing supply store and slip the yarn through the bigger of two O rings. Then double up the yard and then slip the smaller O ring over the larger O ring to form the base of the yarn. I use a magenta colored yarn as I can see in best in pre-dawn conditions. To me even more important than the indicator is to insure that I am getting a natural drift. About 80% of the time you don't need an indicator but the other 20% of the time it is the difference between a hook up or no hook up.

[Anne Vitale]

When I am not using a two fly (one large dry and a nymph) rig as Ken mentioned above, I prefer to watch the floating line for subtle changes in how it is floating. That means I strike a lot. Some time I get to even feel the take and that is worth all the missed takes in the world as far as I'm concerned. :D

I am certain that I must miss most of my takes but hooking every fish that strikes is not as important to me as the fun of casting an unimpeded set up and having to pay very close attention to the details of what I am doing. (Don't talk to me now...can't you see I'm fishing?)

BTW.... while up on the Rogue a couple of weeks ago, I saw a lot of people using small balloons for indicators while drifting for steelhead. I first saw that up in Alaska in September drifting for rainbows so I guess it is becoming more common. The claim is that you can buy balloons for nearly nothing by the bag full as a child's party favor, they are easier to cast and that the drift is more natural. However, I'll still stick with my instincts. :D

[David Lee]

The only time I use the indicator anymore is when fishing for Sunfish in ponds . A Corkie a little larger than a pea , slit to the hole in the middle , pegged w/ a toothpick . I get a charge out of watching that thing skid across the surface .....

For moving water , I almost always high-stick or , on rare occasions , I'll use polypro yarn .

If you ever have the chance , watch Sturmer or MSP . Those guys , especially MSP , can take fish on nymphs like they have XRAY vision :shock: . Quite disturbing to have one of those guys follow you thru a run you've just beaten to a froth .... only to nail several fish that you didn't stick !!

David :D

[burl51]

I only use indicators if the water is really deep 10ft or more.
Otherwise it is high sticking. I learned to do it right on the upper sac
from a guide named Setve Bertrand. Learn to feel the fish and you will never go back to an indicator.

Burl

[bigtj]

Adam,

You forgot to add balloon indicators to the list. Nothing beats a balloon for sensitivity in detecting strikes, ease of casting, versatility in size (you can use the same size balloon to make different sized indicators depending on how much you blow it up), cost, biodegradeability, color options, ease of use (i.e. no maintenance), or ability to float. I used to use yarn indicators but they don't float well, don't break down in the enviornment very easily, and require more maintenance in terms of floatant and combing.

I also use dropper-dry techniques a lot but I don't consider this to be indicator fishing, it is a seperate type of fishing to me.

I rarely nymph fish without a balloon indicator any more. It is such a deadly technique it isn't fair. You can high stick with it, fish it up fish it down, out or in, shallow or deep, rivers or lakes, you can do it all. It's a permanent part of my fishing arsenal.

[Matt Frey]

I have been hearing about using balloons. How do you attach the balloon to the leader?
Thanks

[sacreno]

When I am not using a two fly (one large dry and a nymph) rig as Ken mentioned above, I prefer to watch the floating line for subtle changes in how it is floating. That means I strike a lot. Some time I get to even feel the take and that is worth all the missed takes in the world as far as I'm concerned.

Funny this came up! I was just talking with Bill about this last week in the shop. My father taught me when I was very young to watch the line, leader and or the dry fly. I'm with you Anne Vitale, I too love the thought of fishing by feel. Using an indicator has definite advantages but none of them out weigh the feeling when you set the hook without anything but your instinct. Deep water is a challenge but that is why I don't use then. For the challenge!

[bigtj]

I use rubber bands from the orthadontist to make a slip knot with the leader. Take a couple rubber bands then run a small loop of your leader through them. Wind the loop in and out of the rubber bands a few times (think out, around, back through). Put a very small dollop of floatant on the rubber band for lube then tighten the leader around the balloon by pulling from both sides fo the rubber band. You can slide the balloon anywhere you want up and down the leader a little at a time. Number of rubber bands and wraps of leader depend so you have to experiment - use more for bigger balloons and heavier leader, less for small ballons and light leader. It's much harder to describe this than to just do it. Experiment, it isn't that hard.

Another tip - a balloon about the size of a plump green olive (biggest) to the diameter of a small marble (smallest) sized balloon is just about perfect. You can use bigger - I've used a blown up latex glove as a joke and caught a whitefish with it - but the small ones float a lot of shot and are much easier to cast.

As far as selecting balloons, I like the opaque ones I get from the party supply store. I use a slightly larger balloon (called a "water bomb") and put some air in it without too much pressure and tie it off without stretching the rubber out too much. The more the rubber of the balloon is stretched the more air it will lose mroe quickly. The bigger ballons last about 4-5 days, the smaller ballons will lose air overnight. Not a big deal but I hate to waste or have to replace them if I don't have to.

Also I cut the trailing part of the balloon off below the knot, it's just extraneous material you don't need.

Some guys I know use a surgeon's knot to hold the balloon and don't tie the balloon off with an overhand knot. This leads to less bulk, no rubber band etc. However I don't like the lack of adjustability and some times if you don't seat the knot properly the air will be more likely to escape from the balloon.

My friends used to laugh at me with the whole balloon thing until they saw the results. Now none of the them - and I fish with a lot of guys - use yarn anymore.

Good luck,

-John

[Matt Frey]

Thanks. I will have to give that a try.

[Adam Grace]

I have also used a baloon before, sorry about not including it in the pollm, very easy to cast.

Ken, sorry for not including a piece of floating line on a leader, I am not old school like you and others on the board. Very groovy man. :D

As far as a dry dropper system, I was not including that because I was asking for deep nymphing. The dropper technique is not normaly used when nymphing deep 5-6' and deeper. I love the dry sropper technique but only when fishing more shallow water 6"-3'

More power to you "feel" nymphers, you guys are my heros, that takes the most skill of all.

Thanks for all your input guys. I like hearing about all your different techniques.

[Darian]

What's all this talk about indicatorsto catch crabs :?: :?: :?: All I ever do is get a big, round net and wire some fish guts/heads to the net; attach a rope and drop it over the side.... 8) 8) Uhhh.... Wha's that.... :?: :?: Grabs.... with a G :?: :?: ..... Oh,.... Nevermind.... :roll: :roll: :roll:

[k.hanley]

"Old school" .....what the heck!!!!!!! Watch how you treat your elders young whipper snapper. :lol:
Cheers, Ken
PS: Wait a minute I just looked in the mirror and I am OLD SCHOOL. Dang!

[k.hanley]

Adam I need to get a hold of you. Your email address is........????????
Thanks.
Cheers, Ken