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sculpin
12-08-2005, 08:55 PM
Bubzilla and I wandered down to the Klamath today to try and catch some steelhead and for me just get out of the fog. We accomplished both. The fish we landed were all small and we figured all were under 20".I was 2 for 4 and Bubz was 3 for 4 . We were away from each other when fish were landed so either of us could be lying. However I did take a picture of mine. I managed to do a perfect slow motion splash in the river and can say the water is cold. No wonder the fish seemed in slow motion as well. I also managed to bend the spool on my reel some. As we were leaving Bubz managed to take a good header with only one step left before clearing the river. He didn't get to wet but his knee and rod took a real beating. All in all a normal day on a river.

Mark
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/Sculpin/Picture030.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/Sculpin/Picture031.jpg

jbird
12-08-2005, 10:19 PM
Way to go guys! Its not always easy to go to a new river and hook fish like you guys did. Sorry to hear you two fell. LOL! The klamath really dished out a beating on your guys' equipment. Glad you guys made it out alive :wink:

Jay

Darian
12-08-2005, 10:46 PM
Hey Mark,.... I didn't know Steelies in the Klamath swam upside down. :? :? :lol:

One of the worst dunkings I ever had was in the Klamath near Beaver Creek on a foggy/rainy AM. I stepped off the bank into what I thought was knee deep water and found myself up to my armpits (taking on water) while rapidly flowing down the river. :shock: :shock: I grabbed a passing branch and pulled myself out.... Man, Irish medicine tasted good that AM.... 8) 8)

Sorry to hear about Bubz knee (having a couple of bad ones myself :( )

AndreD
12-08-2005, 11:09 PM
Hey Mark

Sounds like a good tip all the way around minus the slips and falls. So is that one of the Meiz's beauties? Looks like one of his new sticks.

Andre

sculpin
12-09-2005, 07:35 AM
AndreD
Good eye,that is one of Bob's rods I am playing with. It's an 11ft 8/9 switch rod that I am trying out to see if it will work for the way I fish. It's been a challenge to find a line to do what I want it to. This was the first trip with a SA short head and it works pretty well. It's hard to get a system that will fish in close and at some distance and not over power the fish your after.


Mark

AndreD
12-09-2005, 10:11 AM
Hmm, an 11' aye, I didn't know he was making one in that size. I do like those switchers. Gus actually turned me on to those. I tried Bobs 8/9 10' last year and it worked really well. Ended up going 3/5 on the rogue at the ponds, (one was a nice bbq'er). I ended up with the 6/7 switcher on his new FT blanks. I already had a 8wt and figured a strong 6/7 would be ideal for my use down here.

I still haven't gotten a good line for it yet either, right now I am just using my 8wt versatip and its working ok, but I think I will be getting a Hardy Mach 1 based on Bobs suggestions.

AD

WillJ
12-09-2005, 12:28 PM
Sculpin,

<11ft 8/9 switch rod that I am trying out to see if it will work for the way I fish. It's been a challenge to find a line to do what I want it to.>

Could that be single hand spey & roll casting a 10 foot leader with weight & flies? If it is I completely agree. Am curious about the extra length on the switch rods. On the Rogue I've settled into my 9.5 8wt with Rio's AS/S line in a 9wt and I have to say I'm almost completely satisfied.
Glad to hear you got into some fish. Will be down there for a couple days next weekend.

bubzilla
12-09-2005, 04:08 PM
My kneecap was about the size of a softball by the time I got home last night. Luckily I was able to apply the standard treatment: ice pack and quadruple shot of the Balvenie. I kept having Keno stretch flashbacks every time I waded down there without being able to see the bottom; both of us falling on our butts aside it's really not bad down there by comparison to the upper stretches, though. Was nice getting out of the snow for a while. It got warm enough to fish in just a longsleeve shirt by the afternoon. Won't have that again here until the Williamson opens in May.

sculpin
12-09-2005, 07:26 PM
AndreD I'm not sure this rod is in Meisers normal line up. I was trying his 11'-7'' 5/6/7 and felt I needed something with a little more punch but light enough so single hand at times. He handed me this rod to try out.

Willj asked - Could that be single hand spey & roll casting a 10 foot leader with weight & flies?

Yes what you discribe is some of how I fish the Rogue. The Rio S/SH is probably the best line out there for fishing how you discribe. Bubzilla has been using them and I have tried his on my rod quest. The Rio line is great for single hand spey/roll casting . The taper isn't quite right for a two hand cast unless you choke up on the head and shoot line. I'm looking for the magic set up that may be impossible. I want a rod and line capable of two hand casting a very heavy bug and light enough to switch over to single hand use for mending.I may wind up having to do some line cutting and splicing to get the line I want. Bubzilla's eyes got real wide when I mentioned doing this to one of his Rio lines. :lol: :lol: I told him I could make it better , but if it didn't work I would put it back the way it was. :D

Mark

Jasonh
12-09-2005, 07:39 PM
Mark, you might want to try the new rio outbound line. I have heard of some people using this line for both spey and single hand rods. You might have to upsize the line but it could be worth a try.

Jason Hartwick

WillJ
12-10-2005, 04:52 PM
Sculpin,
Keep us posted on your "line splicing experiments", would love to hear what you come up with.
Like I said, I'm "almost" completely satisfied with my rig for the Rogue.
Sometimes I do a double take with my rod when I'm mending and I feel like I'm missing the top section. Which leads me to think I probably wouldn't mind an extra foot and a half.
When pushing big flies & weight from the bank I think you have to overline to get any kind of distance. I know I do.
$0.2.
-Will

sculpin
12-10-2005, 08:16 PM
WillJ
Bubzilla is the Master at roll/singlehand spey casting big heavy bugs and his line of choice is the Rio S/SH line. He was using a 9.5 rod but has moved to a 10'. I use a 10' rod for single hand casting as well. I have spliced a few things together using shooting heads and they worked on the lighter spey rods. When I moved up in rod weight I have to start over. The first thing I want to try is cutting the head off the Rio S/SH line and turning it around. I think it will work and really like how the Rio line rides in the water and doesn't seem to stick like some lines do. I just need to get Bubz drunk and make him think it's a good idea to cut up his new 10wt line in the name of science. :lol:
If you are in the SO. Oregon or traveling in the area we should get together sometime and you can try out what I am playing with.

Mark

bubzilla
12-11-2005, 04:43 PM
I just need to get Bubz drunk and make him think it's a good idea to cut up his new 10wt line in the name of science. :lol:

:lol: That's what it's going to take, too!!!!

WillJ
12-11-2005, 11:14 PM
Mark,
I am in the area (SO. Oregon) and would love to take you up on that.
I think at this point just watching someone that could really push some line out, single-hand & roll casting, would be a real benefit to me. It's really distance and overall enjoyability of casting that I'm looking for improvement on.
I'll have to take a look at the diagram on the RIO box to really get what you're talking about. the front end on that AS/S line is the most abrupt taper I've ever seen. I'm always open to donating for science :D
Took my buddy out today and let him use my set up and I used my RIO Versa-Tip line with the floating head on it. What a f*ing joke that is. once your past the very short head it's like trying to mend sinking running line. Good thing we were only fishing at about 10 feet.
Of course I'm watching him cast 25-30ft pretty easily and it's his first time. That line just casts.
Anyway, would love to hook up sometime. This coming weekend (thurs-sun) I'm gonna split 4 days between the Rogue & Klamath with a good friend & accomplished fisherman that haunts this board as well. If you've got time in there give me a shout. Or leave an address where I can reach you.
Thanks!
Will (in Ashland)
willj@mind.net

PatrickM
12-12-2005, 03:09 PM
I'll go along with the 'good friend" bit, but I'm not so sure about being an "accomplished fisherman." :D Looking forward to hitting the Rogue and Klamath with you, Will. Maybe we'll get to meet some of the So. Oregon crew that post here too?

bubzilla
12-12-2005, 05:21 PM
Will,

The VersaTip does have a short head, but so do some lines specifically designed for indicator nymphing, e.g., the Kelly Galloup Indicator line avaible from Teeny. Lines with short heads have all their mass upfront and therefore make it easy to turn over heavy flies, shot, and indicators. It's exactly the same laws of physics that make it easier to cast big copper tube flies and long chunks of T-14 with a Skagit head than with a longer head spey line. Precisely the same principle. You can nymph very effectively with a short head line--it's just done best slightly differently than it is with a long belly line.

If you research the way most Great Lakes guys nymph for steelhead, you'll see that they use short head lines. They cast out and then steer, or "walk", their fly(s) into the slot with a high rod tip. Done correctly, there's no reason to throw mends with the rod--which is good, becasue again like with the Skagit head example, you can't. The short head is less prone to be swung wildly by compex currents between you and your fly(s) than a long head, and holding the rod tip high further reduces the problem. Also, thinking about your target zone as downstream at a 45--as opposed to straight out--will help with the short heads, too. Just set up the cast and lead the fly(s) through the bucket.

Although the GL guys generally fish smaller rivers, you can do the same thing at pretty good distances as well (50-60 feet easy enough). I personally prefer the longer head lines because I like to use MUCH lighter flies and less added weight--achieving depth by stack mending instead. But if I were going to go back to using more traditional type steelhead nymphs, in terms of size and weight, I wouldn't shy from a shorter belly line in the least. It's not my style of nymphing for steelhead, but it's deadly in its own right.

WillJ
12-13-2005, 12:33 AM
B,
Trying to stay with you there. Think I get what you mean by "dragging" the flies into position as opposed to stacking them up. Getting your "mend" by having less line between you and your float. It also makes sense that the short head would be less influenced by current than the longer bellied line.
I guess I wasn't dyin out there with the line, it's a good backup system, but the loop-to-loop system was rough going through the guides and the line below the taper really sunk. Then again I didn't get the line for the floating head section.
:D
Appreciate your thoughts,
-W