PDA

View Full Version : Dry-fly hackle question -



David Lee
05-19-2005, 01:33 PM
Stupid question time .... :oops:

Which way does the shiny side of the hackle face , the eye or the bend ???

Thanks , David

SullyTM
05-19-2005, 01:53 PM
David...no such thing as a stupid question. I tie hackels shiny side up by the butt end. Hope this helps. SullyTM

P.S. It's 1:50PM and still raining... :x

David Lee
05-19-2005, 02:04 PM
Thanks , Thom .

Funky strange weather .... don't you think ?? By the way , the Teton #4 reel showed up , now I have to get a line for it :twisted:

The fly is looking like a cross between a Stimulator and a Madam X ...... Large and UGLY - David

SullyTM
05-19-2005, 02:29 PM
Funky strange indeed. I have an outdoor graduation event tonight and the main event on Sunday(should be in the 80's by then)...

http://flyfisherman.com/ftb/hwhackel/ has nice pictures and instructions, FYI.

I have an aluminum Martin #4 reel with a floating line. It was my first fly reel ever which I probably didn't use 3 times when I got it over 30 years ago. I also have the rod but I'm looking for a new 4 weight. Later.

Darian
05-19-2005, 08:49 PM
Thom,.... I'm curious... :? :? . When you tie the hackle in by the tip with the shiny side up, which direction does the hackle lean :?: :?: Concave side forward (toward the eye of the hook) or back as in a wet fly :?: :?: I always tie dry flies with the concave side of the hackle facing the eye of the hook and by the stripped butt 8) 8)

In the method I use in tying a Stimulator, the concave side of the hackle tied over the abdomen may be tied in facing the bend of the hook (depending on your preference).... 8) . The concave side of the hackle tied over the thorax is facing the eye of the hook..... :D

David Lee
05-19-2005, 09:07 PM
Concave , convex .... phooey !! I've been drinking , for Pete's sake - shiny side to the eye or the bend - english please :!:

You guys are difficult , sometimes . :P

David

Bill Kiene semi-retired
05-19-2005, 09:26 PM
The shinny side goes to the bend on a dry fly, I believe.

Darian
05-19-2005, 09:33 PM
Thom,..... I meant to say when you tie the hackle in by the butt (not the tip)..... :oops: :oops:

It's Hell to get old :shock: :D

David Lee
05-19-2005, 09:38 PM
Gentlemen ( :P :P :P ) , I thank you . David

Bill Kiene semi-retired
05-19-2005, 10:02 PM
When I started tying 100 years ago they had no genetic dry fly necks. They all came from India and China where the chikens ran free. We had to put 3 or 4 hackles on a hook to get a good floating dry fly.

Today with genetic saddles you can tie 3 or 4 flies with one hackle.

At my first fly shop in 1975 I would buy 100 India dry fly necks ungraded from Andre Puyan from Creative Sports in Walnut Creek. Hal Janssen taught me how to grade them. First we would put them all in piles according to colors. Coachman Brown, Red Game, Creme, Cocubondi, Badger, Furnace and Cree.

Then we would grade them for how small of dry fly they would tie. You also felt them to see how thick the area was with the small hackles. You would bend the hackles and touch the barbials to your upper lip to feel how stiff they were. Then it was all about how long the small hackle stems were.

I think AAA, AA, A, B and C were the grades.

The best ones would go for $5 and down and the worst you would put in a barrel for $1.

I think dry fly grizzly necks were $8?

The big deal was to be able to die a nice blue dun. You would take some of the best crème necks and die them blue dun.

I use to buy entire dried animal skins from a furrier in Sacramento. I bought beaver, muskrat, rabbit, badger, squirrel, and bear. Then we cut them into squares and put them in plastic bags and labeled them.

We bought deer, elk, moose and caribou hides too.

I use to die rooster necks and saddle on my old gas stove in South Sac.

These were the good old days.

I remember the first Henry Hoffman genetic dry fly necks from Oregon. Only a few fly shops ever got any. I think Kaufmann's, Baileys and Marriott bought them all. People bought them just to show off.

David Lee
05-19-2005, 10:23 PM
bill - Did you know Ed Story ?? He ran Feather-craft out of St. Louis , Mo. but used to be a seal-hunter ( !!!!!!) here back in the early 50s . I B.S. w/ him every now and again and love the stories about the "old" stuff people tyed with .

Most of us "younger" guys now a days have NO IDEA just how good we have it - I mean .... life without Flashabou ?? You must be joking !!!!

David

Bill Kiene semi-retired
05-19-2005, 10:39 PM
I would say that 90% of what we have today did not exist back then.

Many bought their tying supplies from the Herter’s catalog.

Some bought from Buz's mail order in Visalia. It was out of Buz's garage. I was there once myself.

Don Frasier was in Ruff and Ready near Grass Valley.

Art Dadini was in Ferndale off the Eel River.

For fly tying material wholesalers we had 'Hash's Herl & Hackle' and the 'Hackle House' who would call on the sporting goods stores that I worked at from 1965 to 1975. They had postage stamp size pieces of fur on the hide.

Yes, even then packaged dubbing did not exist. You bought everything on the hide. There was no synthetic stuff either.

Darian
05-20-2005, 12:20 AM
Yep,.... The Hackle House was located in San Carlos in the Bay Area not very far from where I lived. Still have some Polar Bear I bought from 'em at $0.50 a package :shock: :shock: .

Also, still have the original Pflueger 1495 1/2 fly reel I bought from a shop named Imbert & Smithers in San Carlos.... (still very usable in spite of all I put it thru 8) 8) ). Loaned my Fenwick FF 85 glass fly rod to a friend who wanted to get started fly fishing.... Haven't seen it since :lol: (hope it's still peforming as well for him as it did for me :wink: :wink: ).

Rick J
05-20-2005, 06:35 AM
Bill, you did not raise your own chickens??? I can see it now!

SullyTM
05-20-2005, 07:11 AM
Darian...Check out the website http://flyfisherman.com/ftb/hwhackel/
That is, for the most part how I tie in hackels. Sometimes I tie them it by the feather tip...I'm not a purist so palmering hackles properly is lost on me...Yes, it is a bummer getting old, but it beats the alternative...Thom

Bill Kiene semi-retired
05-20-2005, 07:57 AM
Hey Rick,

I remember some of my customers would go to an auction and by old roosters for $2? Live roosters...........

We stopped for road kills too.

People would bring me deer and elk hides and I would use them too.

I once had a Polar Bear hide.

SullyTM
05-20-2005, 09:20 AM
Bill...Nothing wrong with recycling roadkill. When I was in Michigan in April I got some nice roadkill bucktail hair and some red squirrel tail hair. Couldn't find any dead black squirrels! My rental wasn't fast enough :lol:

David Lee
05-20-2005, 09:35 AM
Bill...Nothing wrong with recycling roadkill. When I was in Michigan in April I got some nice roadkill bucktail hair and some red squirrel tail hair. Couldn't find any dead black squirrels! My rental wasn't fast enough :lol:

Thom - :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

Good one ! David

Darian
05-20-2005, 10:11 AM
Thom,.... By recycling I assume you're talking about fly tying materials, not...... Oh,..... Nevermind :roll: :roll: :roll: :P

SullyTM
05-20-2005, 11:13 AM
Darian...Unlike the Beverly Hillbillies, I DID NOT throw Bambie on the hood of my car! Though venison stew did cross my mind :oops: Oh, one other thing. I always have a pair of rubber gloves and baggies in the trunk just in case... :twisted:

kbarton
06-06-2005, 01:36 PM
I remember walking to school in San Francisco one morning - Cal Bird had been using some Australian Opossum in his tying demonstration at the club that weekend - when I spotted a freshly thumped Opossum lying near the curb...

I scanned the surrounding houses quickly for mean old ladies, then whipped out the ever-present dull Buck knife and skinned the corpse in between an 81' Honda and a T-Bird.

What was left over (after pocketing my booty) was a naked pink torso that might have passed for a small dog or cat... Fearing reprisal, I melted into the underbrush as quickly as I could ....I just knew that Madam Flauntleroy was liable to fetch her paper and see me preparing her missing tabby for the barbeque....

Darian
06-06-2005, 10:17 PM
What,.... No Possum stew :?: :?: :?: :P :P

Digger
06-12-2005, 08:24 AM
Just what does 'genetic' mean in terms of hackle anyway?


You know, it's too bad dog hair isn't used. I have a golden retriever that has an annual shedding season...starts in January and ends in December.

Adam Grace
06-12-2005, 08:27 AM
That's quite a season Digger. :D

Bob Scheidt
06-12-2005, 07:36 PM
Genetic hackle could mean birds raised only for their feathers. It wouldn't be US only, cause that would be domestic. Possibly gene tracking, recording and defining would play into the definition also.
Bob Scheidt