Spearfishing Writeup NFF

[Mike O]

http://www.mensjournal.com/adventure/watersports/freshwater-spearfishing-fishings-controversial-new-frontier-20150220

[David Lee]

"Young is one of a few hundred divers pioneering a new niche sport: deep-sea-style spearfishing, in the waterways of California's Central Valley."

A few hundred divers will clean 'em all out in no time , since Stripes of all sizes will swim right up to you .

"Niche sport" ? Spearfishing is a MARINE sport , and shouldn't be allowed in freshwater , period .

Oh , one more thing - fuck the dfw in this sorry State for allowing it .

D.~

[STEELIES/26c3]

What D said...

Fish and Game has morphed from an agency interested in maintaining healthy, productive fisheries and wildlife and opportunities for anglers and hunters...

into an agency bought and sold by politicians, bureaucrats and corporate interests.

It has changed its name to distance itself from the mission of sustainable HARVEST to PSEUDO-conservators of our fisheries and WILDLIFE.

It is unfortunate that the spearos align with the false pretense that striped bass (not mismanagement of our water in the SAC/SJ Delta and its tributaries) are to blame for the rapid decline of salmonids. (POD correlates directly with increased and sustained pumping of water out of the delta) and has affected ALL species therein, INCLUDING striped bass...

Word has it (from a long time, local, CDFW game warden) that CDFW is also moving towards a cessation of rearing Eel River strain steelhead at the Nimbus Hatchery (in order to promote success of the native, Central Valley strain of O. Mykiss)

Sounds great on paper don't it? Only one problem, the original strain of American River Steelhead is not threatened or endangered... it is EXTINCT!).

As I understand it, the steelhead indigenous to the American River would come up the river in April-July, They would be bright and NOT yet ripe but would migrate upriver and in to the foothill tributaries of Tahoe and El Dorado Forests (prior to dam construction of course).

As the water would be considerably colder in the mountain, snow-melt waters, the steelhead would have no problem holding over until the fall by which time they would be strong and ripe from a piscivorous diet and have the necessary energy to spawn and get back to the ocean.

What limited number of DESCENDANT-HYBRIDS from this now-watered-down strain of fish remain in our river will never be able to flourish as they did prior to the erection of the dam in 1950 so CDFW's proposal to restore them is preposterous.

They've been watching too many Jurassic Park movies...

The amount of viable habitat ALONE (even with the half-assed gravel restoration projects DWR has implemented over the last 7 years) is less than 1/100th of 1 percent its original size AND is subject to; gravel migration, low flows and de-watering at critical times. Excess water temperatures below the dam also make the reintroduction of Central Valley steelhead to the American River a 'pipe dream'

Even many of the creel census guys and gals and streambed and spwaning survey monitoring crew who work for USFW, DRW and BOR have admitted to me on the river that the data they are gathering and projects they are involved in are futile...

There is so little science in resource management decisions any more. To find a true motive, one needs only to follow the money trail.

It gets harder and harder to care anymore but I still do care a whole lot. I love our beleaguered little river. It just keeps giving and giving so much despite that it gets so little in return...

[David Lee]

"Sounds great on paper don't it? Only one problem, the original strain of American River Steelhead is not threatened or endangered... it is EXTINCT!)."

Bingo . Or diluted to the point where genetically .... it just isn't viable to 'bring back' at this point in time . Someday , perhaps ... but back to the matter at hand -

It's legal to spear Striped Bass in freshwater . So - if we follow this disturbing trend ... now we should have the 'ethics' to allow us to shoot a Deer on the neighbors' lawn , at Night ? Spearing freshwater Gamefish is OK , so can we clean all the Brown Trout out , along with those worthless hatchery Salmon ... or non-native warmwater Bass and Sunfish ? I know .... go and ground-sluice a whole covey of Quail and brag about it without getting your sorry Ass beaten ?

As a life long Hunter and Fisherman ... this isn't the way I was taught , and it will never be the way it's supposed to be . If you are not 100% in tune with that , you should be hanging your Head in shame and never consider yourself a SPORTSMAN .

D.~

[STEELIES/26c3]

Sorry David, I did stray from the original topic.

It's all related however in that CDFW has become an inept agency more interested in SEEMING to care about fisheries and wildlife than actually protecting them...

I agree spearfishing has no place in freshwater for many many reasons.

I'm also insulted by the writers synopsis of striper anglers as bobber and hook types... There is a lot more skill in plugging with lures and/or swinging or popping flies for stripers than swimming with them and shooting them with a speargun.

[rtb215]

Follow the money!!!

R

[Tony Buzolich]

This is just as gut wrenching as it was when it came up before. The Dept. of Fish & Wildlife changed it's name from Dept. of Fish & Game because "Game" implies "to hunt or take". So with this they, like David said, are shying away from managing the take of game.

Don't you think this insane decision about spearing inland "game" fish came about by the water mungers doing everything they can to blame the stripers for the failing salmon population and not the water diversions in the delta? Big money corporate interests buy anything they want, and if it means buying the DFW they did. Blame the stripers and take the eyes off the water diversions. Blame anything they want just don't watch what we're doing with the water. Buy the DFW and they've just gotten another nail in the coffin as for diverting water.

Damn this pisses me off, Tony

[Spicytuna1]

..........................

[Darian]

I've been watching this thread to see how it would go. Lots of emotion involved. I have to admit that I have the same knee-jerk reaction everyone else has had to this development. I love fishing for Stripers and any warm/salt water species and don't like this change but....

From DFW perspective, I'd have to say that changing the regs to allow spearfishing for Stripers goes back to the settlement agreement debated in prior threads and the related, proposed reg change to increase in take limits that ultimately was not adopted. DFW still has to address the Striper issue. Also, DFW had a part in developing the BDCP that contains plans to target removal of Stripers for protection of endangered/threatened species by DFW staff. Now comes the change to allow spearfishing for Stripers in freshwater.... If I'm DFW staff, this change allows expansion of recreational activity while accomplishing the objective of targeting Stripers for managing to reduce predation and the number/size of the population, indirectly. Allowing spearfishing is attractive to DFW as the cost to them is minimal.

DFW seems to be caught between attempting to return fisheries to include native species, only. That requires a major effort to reduce or eliminate the impacts (positive and negative) of non-native/invasive species. So, to fail to target Stripers appears to conflict with that objective.

Over on Blanton's BB, there's a thread discussing the condition of Stripers caught in the Delta, recently. They appear to be under weight for their size (that's perception, not scientific measurement). POD may be contributing to a decline of the size and numbers of Stripers. The amount of Hyacinth in Delta waters is growing and the impact on water is the uptake of small particles (including pelagic organisms) resulting in clear water and a reduction of food at the bottom of the food chain. This loss must contribute to "thinner" Stripers caught recently. Further, when Hyacinth dies off, it sinks to the bottom, degrades and depletes dissolved oxygen. Fish can't live comfortably in water with reduced oxygen levels. Compounding the issue, spraying efforts by the Dep't of Boating and Waterways contributes to die-off. Spraying is sporadic, so, it isn't done consistently. All of this adds up to a "whammy" on fish of all types.

I guess my point is that regardless of the change to allow spearfishing, there will be continued decline in fish populations, due to any number of environmental/political conditions/demands in this day/age. This thread makes me want to go over to the Media Forum to look at the video on "Dangerous Bears" for a laugh....

ps. Forgot to mention the possibility that the lack of hatchery Trout making it to the Delta due to trucking around them around it, also contributes to the lack of food for Stripers, etc.

[STEELIES/26c3]

This is just as gut wrenching as it was when it came up before. The Dept. of Fish & Wildlife changed it's name from Dept. of Fish & Game because "Game" implies "to hunt or take". So with this they, like David said, are shying away from managing the take of game.

Don't you think this insane decision about spearing inland "game" fish came about by the water mungers doing everything they can to blame the stripers for the failing salmon population and not the water diversions in the delta? Big money corporate interests buy anything they want, and if it means buying the DFW they did. Blame the stripers and take the eyes off the water diversions. Blame anything they want just don't watch what we're doing with the water. Buy the DFW and they've just gotten another nail in the coffin as for diverting water.

Damn this pisses me off, Tony

Yup Exactly... the same water mongers (Coalition for a 'sustainable Delata' hahaha what a sick joke of a name that was...) that filed a lawsuit against Fish and Game 4 years ago.

I was on the Capitol steps with CSBA speaking out against them

and I was at the CDFW public comment hearing in Rio Vista when Marty Gingras et al were trying to promote a reduced size limit and increased take on stripers from inland waters if implemented would have decimated our striper fishery.

Fish and Game has become so whooped by the Feds and by big water and by politicians that they make decisions in order to not ruffle feathers and to appease those in power and worse... in the upper echelon of the organization... sell policy to those who keep their jobs intact.

Ironic is this trend to restore our natural resources to a time before humans F' ed it all up but in so doing.... they are F' ing things up even worse as they implement policies and laws towards an unattainable outcome...

[Charlie S]

Please Spicytuna...I do hope you are kidding. If not, then be aware that you would probably be charged with up to attempted murder, or worse if you cut a vital artery with such a hook. And that doesn't even address the civil liabilities you would face...you probably would end up supporting a spear fisherman for the rest of his life. So, stay calm and use your enthusiasm to lobby for a change in the law.

[Spicytuna1]

I was ridiculously far from serious.

Carry on

[Mark V]

Was the writer simply trying to stir up more clicks? If you look at the RH column list of Most Popular articles on that site, seems it's a mag by and for--uh, less intellectual--men.


Found this contact email, and started writing them an email:

To: letters@mensjournal.com

Subject: request correction statement for article on freshwater spearfishing

Dear Mr. Nestor,

Your article about freshwater spearfishing struck a huge nerve with guys like me who live in Sacramento and fish for stripers in our rivers.

I believe you unwittingly repeated a statement about striped bass that is at best a sneaky, politically motivated lie: the "invasive species" label.

What you may not understand if you don't live in California and follow the political battles over water is, ....


I plan to complete an email polite, even invite the guy to come to Sac and come on my boat and catch a striper on the river like a mature, intelligent person would, i.e. in a way that doesn't devastate everyone else's chances of catching one again.


We need to come up with a strategy to win the propaganda war against the "invasive" scapegoat/diversion campaign.

And maybe separately, create a strategy to lobby DFW to change the regs back. Or perhaps a compromise rule that limits the size (slot limit) that might apply to stripers caught by ANY means. Would that be a move that helps grow the population of stripers? Don't want to confuse the issue, or divide our response.

There have been times in the past when our side has won battles to change laws and DFW regs, right? Who are the ppl who came up with the strategy and implemented the steps to victory? We need to draft them again and join them in the battle. It's so depressing to hear that DFW has been bought and the war is lost forever.

[Tony Buzolich]

Mark,

You touched on another nerve that could really excite a lot of folks,,,, Black Bass ! Did you know that Black bass are NOT native to California either. Do you have any idea how popular Black Bass tournaments are in the delta? Now, start getting the word out that black bass eat more of those delta smelt than stripers do and watch the tournament guys go crazy. Ya ! Black bass guys will go crazy if they think "their" fish is going to get nailed to the cross too.

What about ALL the other fish in California that we've grown up with that ARE'NT native species? What about all the myriads of sunfish, crappie, and catfish ? All Non-Native. What about TROUT ? Brook trout? Brown trout, even Kokonee ? Again, non-natives.

Except for rainbow trout and salmon and squawfish (California Pike Minnow) it's easier to name a non-native fish that we've grown up with and considered to be native than it is to actually name a true native.

I grew up fishing with my dad for striped bass for as long as I can remember till he died. That's a long time. And even back then I remember my dad being happy to take a nice 6# or 8#er, saying these were the best eating. He knew that the bigger fish had something in them that wasn't good (mercury), and he's been gone for more than fifty years. And now, with all of the toxins and pesticides in our rivers and lakes, why do they even allow the take of bigger size fish laden with these poisons?

Geez,,,,, I get on a roll. Sorry guys but sometimes we just have to vent. Tony

[Mark V]

Tony, Good point about the black bass and other "non-native" fish. A good angle in the propaganda war. Maybe you'll also send a note to the nice ppl at Men's Journal?

Also about the mercury in those giant, old fish. I've never tasted flesh from a fish over 25 years old--I'm guessing it doesn't taste very good, and always thought guys like Mr. Young just say they eat 'em, but actually just enjoy the killing, and carcasses go in the garbage after the genocide photos.

Btw, the article said: Young says "I could have shot a dozen fish today, but I didn't.

I guess Mr. Young doesn't know about the fishing Regs 2 per day limit on stripers? I just re-opened the .pdf Regs 2014-15 and re-read the instances containing "spear" and "striped bass". Seems clear the 2/day limit applies to the spear chuckers. -Mark

[Darian]

If you use the search function on this BB, enter the title of this post, a number of threads on this subject come up starting around 5/5/13 come up. Lengthy discussion and lots of info there.

[Hatch]

Unless you are an indigenouse indian...... we are all invasive !!!! And as far as spear fisherman on the A.R. goes.... I will never be O.K. with it and if they are near my sled when I am on the water I will do all I can to make their attempts fail.... I promise...:cool:
Lets Get It On.......

[MendoFish]

I don't know where you guys get this notion that it's so easy. If it is I challenge one of you, anyone... get in the water and try it. You don't have to bring a spear. Bring a camera. Lets see you dive and get lined up within range of one and film it. It's easy, shouldn't be hard to just hop on down and get one on camera-they swim right up to you all the time. :roll eyes:


I had to make half a dozen trips before even seeing one. More before seeing one that wasn't tiny. More to get close enough to one. More to get close enough long enough at the right angle to even think about a shot.

I H&L too, how many of you dive? I do both, and I can tell you sitting on the boat with a drink is a hell of a lot easier than diving, especially in that death trap.


FYI- That article was pretty messed up. I believe Paul even said that journalist took a lot out of context and misquoted a lot of things. Typical media.