Spearfishing on the American; it has begun

[Fish Guru]

Talked to a friend this morning who was lunching at Howe to hunt for some stripes and shad, he said a spear guy was gearing up in the lot. This has the potentail for big trouble to the resident fish in that section, hopefully( but I doubt it) they dont take the big girls that never leave that area. :mad:
Does anyone know if it's even legal to use a spear gun in the American River parkway? I know they passed the bill allowing the spearos to do thier thing but I'm wondering if it's even legal to posess a spear gun in the parkway. I'm thinking it's not but if anyone has any insight on this then feel free to chime in.

[Tony Buzolich]

You all know damn well that if there's a choice for this guy to shoot a big fish vs. a little fish he will without thought shoot the biggest fish that comes into his sight. He probably has no idea how old that big fish is, how much mercury is stored in it's flesh, or how killing it takes millions of eggs out of the future spawning population.

Damn b*#@%#d probably won't even eat it. He'll just take a picture, brag it up, and throw it in a dumpster somewhere. If it is legal and permitted there ought to signs up about what killing these larger fish does to the population. What about posting signs in or around local dive shops that sell spearguns. Maybe get the shop owners to make an effort to protect these "unedible" big fish.

Damn AGAIN! The next thing you know they'll be spearing them in the Feather! Ya, I'm pissed,
Tony

[Tony Buzolich]

I just went to the American River Parkway rules and regulations page and found this.

9.36.060 Firearms, Air Guns, and Other Weapons.
No person other than peace officers in the discharge of their duties shall use, maintain, possess, fire, or
discharge any firearm, air gun, spring gun, bow and arrow, slingshot, or any other weapon potentially
dangerous to wildlife or human safety, except in areas, at times, and under conditions designated by the
director for such use. A violation of the provisions of this section is a misdemeanor. (SCC 576 § 15, 1983.)

This more than enough states "SPEARGUNS" are NOT allowed in the parkway. Even if it is legal elsewhere it clearly states that these types of "sporting equipment" aren't allowed.

Now, who is going to enforce it? If they can't keep up with all the vandalism how are they ever going to stay on top of this too? If they (the park people) choose to ignore this they might as well allow *?+#^%& to shoot salmon with bow and arrows.
Tony

[Mike O]

Or maybe, spearos like me will go out and follow the regs, while still maintaining the ethics we were raised with, and limit our kill, not kill our limit, and eat what we spear.

But then, I am a "Damn b*#@%#d" (which would really surprise my dad, if it's true...do you have evidence, pictures, etc?) and all, so who knows?

Mike

[Mike O]

I just went to the American River Parkway rules and regulations page and found this.

9.36.060 Firearms, Air Guns, and Other Weapons.
No person other than peace officers in the discharge of their duties shall use, maintain, possess, fire, or
discharge any firearm, air gun, spring gun, bow and arrow, slingshot, or any other weapon potentially
dangerous to wildlife or human safety, except in areas, at times, and under conditions designated by the
director for such use. A violation of the provisions of this section is a misdemeanor. (SCC 576 § 15, 1983.)

This more than enough states "SPEARGUNS" are NOT allowed in the parkway. Even if it is legal elsewhere it clearly states that these types of "sporting equipment" aren't allowed.

Now, who is going to enforce it? If they can't keep up with all the vandalism how are they ever going to stay on top of this too? If they (the park people) choose to ignore this they might as well allow *?+#^%& to shoot salmon with bow and arrows.
Tony


Guess we have to leave pocketknives at home, then?

[Scott V]

Not all spear fisherman are bad, and to generalize them all as one group is stupid and ignorant. Just like saying that all fly fisherman are snobs, which is not true but it is just the same. So please people, stop generalizing. I know plenty of fly fisherman that would keep a big old female if they caught it, so should we attack them as one group?

[WinterrunRon]

As long as the spears are barbless, I don't see it being an issue.

[SHigSpeed]

As long as the spears are barbless, I don't see it being an issue.
Hahaha!

_SHig

[TaylerW]

As long as the spears are barbless, I don't see it being an issue.

AHAHAHAHAH. Now thats funny right there

[Mike O]

Mine is barbless..looks like this. If it's good for legal lingcod, oughta work for legal stripers.

http://www.amazon.com/Stainless-Steel-Paralyzer-Spear-Head/dp/B0064Q9974

[Darian]

After my initial, emotional, reaction to the change in the regs on this, I've adopted the approach that I've had on other issues of this nature. If it's legal, I'm not going to say to much about it. We all had our say in what we thought the outcome of spearfishing for Stripers would be and the regs were changed anyway. Striper Mike (McKenzie) is working with a group of fishers/spearos to reach some type of agreement for a proposal to modify the change. Not much else we can do for now.

Not sure that spears/spearguns are banned by the section cited. Seems like there's room to interpret the code to apply to wildlife, not fish, and the weapons listed don't specifically identify spearguns. Could "....air guns, spring guns...." be seen as spears/spearguns?? They wouldn't normally be used to kill wildlife. Looks to me like the weapons listed are those that are commonly used on land not under water but since the section is obviously aimed at public safety maybe it does cover spears/spearguns. :confused: Probably a good idea to call the Sac County Parks Department for clarification before heading to the river.

I agree with the sentiment of Mike O that most, if not all, of the spearo's will be ethical and most everyone will follow legal requirements. We have to hope that everyone realizes the impact of killing large Stripers has on their population and dangers to health of consumming large amounts of mercury laden fish. Hopefully, they won't take/kill Stripers exclusively for photo ops; then toss 'em. Some may not but that's not much different than those fisherman who do the same, each year.

Time to move on.

[Fish Guru]

You guys are only kidding yourselves if you think that the ethical spearos are the only ones to utilize these new regulations. For years there have been a few scumbags who used to illegally spear large stripers on the American, I have personally seen them dragging multiple large fish on a couple of occasions. These same guys will be all over this now that it's legal, and in clear water like the American and Feather a few could do a lot of damage in a short amount of time. There are many people out there who don't care about ethics or the importance of not killing large stripers, they only want as much as they can take right now.
And Darian, I'm pretty sure that a speargun would fall under the category of not allowed in the parkway, but I will be checking on this once back in town to be sure.

[Mike O]

And there are no unethical anglers? This will turn out to be a wash. The ethicals and unethicals will even out. And all of us "Damn b*#@%#d"s will be able to use the resource, like all of us pure-as-the-driven-snow FFers.

It IS legal to keep trophy stripers caught on a fly, no?

[OceanSunfish]

The concern is really about the OPPORTUNISTS that take up spearfishing..... I highly doubt the spirit of Mike O trascends to said OPPORTUNISTS, otherwise, they would've been spearfisherman long before the reg change.

Poachers are poachers. The new reg just handed them another methodology, that unfortunately, isn't illegal.

And with the current low flows on the A...... ugh.

[Mike McKenzie]

Talked to a friend this morning who was lunching at Howe to hunt for some stripes and shad, he said a spear guy was gearing up in the lot. This has the potentail for big trouble to the resident fish in that section, hopefully( but I doubt it) they dont take the big girls that never leave that area. :mad:
Does anyone know if it's even legal to use a spear gun in the American River parkway? I know they passed the bill allowing the spearos to do thier thing but I'm wondering if it's even legal to posess a spear gun in the parkway. I'm thinking it's not but if anyone has any insight on this then feel free to chime in.

While I can't quote the "American River Parkway" rules and regs the Spearfisher was legal with respect to the Fish & Game Code. Here is a list of waters that are now open to spearfishing for striped bass..

2.30. Spearfishing.
Spearfishing is permitted only in:

(a) The Colorado River District for carp, tilapia, goldfish and mullet, all year.
(b) The Valley District and Black Butte Lake (Tehama County) for carp, tilapia, goldfish, striped bass, western sucker, Sacramento blackfish, hardhead, Sacramento pikeminnow and lamprey, from May 1 through September 15, except that no spearfishing is permitted in:
(1) Shasta County (see Section 2.12).
(2) Tehama County except Black Butte Lake.
(3) Butte Creek (Butte Co.).
(4) Feather River below Oroville Dam (Butte Co.). (Take note Tony B.)

(5) Designated salmon spawning areas (See Fish and Game Code Section 1505). Which are described as:

The American River between Nimbus Dam and a point one mile downstream from Arden Way. (Which
would be about the bend in the river north of the intersection of Folsom Blvd and Passeo Rio Way)
The Mokelumne River between Pardee Dam and Lockeford.
The Stanislaus River between Goodwin Dam and Riverbank.
The Tuolumne River between La Grange Dam and the Geer Road (J14) Bridge.
The Merced River between Crocker Huffman Dam and Cressey.

Back in January when the striped bass community first learned that this reg change was coming, we had a lot of reservations about what would happen to the big female stripers that reside in the rivers.

We had a conference call between representatives of both striped bass fishers and spearfishers during which many of the fears were allayed. It was pointed out that in reality the big females would not be "sitting ducks" as was the common fear...Also for the most part the spearos stated they would not target the big females for the same reasons that we don't... Throughout the conversation they were reasonable and informed about the fishery.. We all agreed to see how it all shakes out and to keep an eye on things as the season progresses. Also, DFG will be watching for any excess harvest and or poaching that the reg. change might foster in the market fishing and poaching community that we all know about.

Mike

[Mark Kranhold]

They did open it up this year for spearguns from the arden rapids and down. Have a friend that is really into saltwater spear fishing and he is planning on hittin the American. I warned him not to take the big ones and only target the 5- 8 lbers....best eating.

[Mike O]

While I can't quote the "American River Parkway" rules and regs the Spearfisher was legal with respect to the Fish & Game Code. Here is a list of waters that are now open to spearfishing for striped bass..

4) Feather River below Oroville Dam (Butte Co.). (Take note Tony B.)
This is only the Feather in Butte County.



Thank you for your well reasoned response. Nice to know some people don't consider us "damned b@$+@&6"s

[Tony Buzolich]

With respect Mike O, I didn't label you as anything. You labeled yourself as a "spearo" and now made everyone on this board aware that you intend to kill striped bass in the American River.

If I see ANYONE keeping or killing a large striper I have a talk with them. I see plenty of fishermen keeping big fish that should have been released. Most are caught throwing swim baits or dunking minnows and sardines and are caught legally by chance. A few of these guys that fish regularly WILL throw the big ones back. Even some of the more reputible guides will encourage their clients to release the big one back into the river system. They are aware of the harm killing these big fish will do to future populations and I applaud their effort for trying to save these big fish while at the same time keeping their clients happy.

As a former spearfisher myself, I am well aware of barbed shafts, reel packs, and pole spears like Hawaiian Slings. Three prong spear heads like you've shown are not meant for large fish and were designed around killing small reef fish for food. Using a head like this on a "legal size" striper will more than likely result in a lost fish now with fatal injuries left to die a slow death.

I have no problem with spearing all the trash fish there are, but to spear a game fish is like paying to shoot a trophy buck or elk in a fenced coral.

Lastly, with the use of spears and other such equipment, there is no such thing as Catch & Release. Nor is there any way to accurately measure the size of the fish before shooting it.
Tony

[winxp_man]

I stopped eating striper when striper after striper in the 5-10 lbs were full of some sort of worms. But I can see the concern about people targeting bigger fish. I hope it will not be the case but we will see as time progresses.

[Mike O]

You all know damn well that if there's a choice for this guy to shoot a big fish vs. a little fish he will without thought shoot the biggest fish that comes into his sight. He probably has no idea how old that big fish is, how much mercury is stored in it's flesh, or how killing it takes millions of eggs out of the future spawning population.

Damn b*#@%#d probably won't even eat it. He'll just take a picture, brag it up, and throw it in a dumpster somewhere. If it is legal and permitted there ought to signs up about what killing these larger fish does to the population. What about posting signs in or around local dive shops that sell spearguns. Maybe get the shop owners to make an effort to protect these "unedible" big fish.

Damn AGAIN! The next thing you know they'll be spearing them in the Feather! Ya, I'm pissed,
Tony

Do you know who this guy is? The one you labeled a "Damn b*#@%#d"? I bet not. Which means, by association, all of us who spear stripers are "Damn b*#@%#d"s because it could be anyone. And it's offensive, because you did not say IF he keeps a fish, he is a "Damn b*#@%#d", you made the assumption that the "Damn b*#@%#d probably won't even eat it. He'll just take a picture, brag it up, and throw it in a dumpster somewhere." And by association, that could have been me. So yes, your lump sum, knee-jerk reaction offended me.

If you want to "have a talk" to people who spear big stripers, do you also "have a talk" with those who keep trophies on the river? Every time?

[Garrett S Realtor]

I am not worried about the guys that want to eat striper, I am am worried about the die hard steelheaders out there that think striper have a major effect on the survival rate of salmon and steelhead. They are going to grab their spearguns and hunt the big boys because in their opinion they do the most damage. I have a mutual friend who has this opinion about striper and he dives the river and knows where to find the 20lb+ stripers in the river. Bye Bye striper fishery, I will miss you...and the sad thing is I never got into a big one. I am going out with a big heavy spoon with a treble hook to fish for striper and if I accidentally snag a spear fisherman....oh well

[Mike O]

Yah. That'll help. Nothing like a little public premeditation before your attempt at battery on someone participating in a legal activity.

[Dan Harrison]

You all know damn well that if there's a choice for this guy to shoot a big fish vs. a little fish he will without thought shoot the biggest fish that comes into his sight. He probably has no idea how old that big fish is, how much mercury is stored in it's flesh, or how killing it takes millions of eggs out of the future spawning population.

Damn b*#@%#d probably won't even eat it. He'll just take a picture, brag it up, and throw it in a dumpster somewhere. If it is legal and permitted there ought to signs up about what killing these larger fish does to the population. What about posting signs in or around local dive shops that sell spearguns. Maybe get the shop owners to make an effort to protect these "unedible" big fish.

Damn AGAIN! The next thing you know they'll be spearing them in the Feather! Ya, I'm pissed,
Tony

Well said Tony I couldn't agreed with you more!!!

[Tony Buzolich]

Thank you, Dan. It's hard enough to keep the striper population going, and the thought of one more action that will reduce those numbers is gut wrenching.

I'm sure that anyone who partakes of this "sport" isn't doing it because they need to eat. It's simply a matter killing a game animal and the joy of the hunt. Why can't they target the trash fish and do something good by reducing those numbers? How about killing a few more carp, and squawfish (pike-minnows), and even suckers that inhabit the American and the river systems?

Instead of doing something good to help the gamefish populations they choose to kill them. Bowfishing is a great way to help reduce numbers of trash fish across the country. I'm sure spearfishing for them would be encouraged there too, and they'd be helping the environment rather than taking another gamefish out of the struggling population that we're trying to save.

There's just no such thing as catch and release with a spear or an arrow.
Tony

[Scott V]

This post is getting real stupid with assumptions and personal feelings. If it is legal then let it be. Plenty of people feel that guides are killing fish every day by hooking and landing them so they can take the fish out of water to take that hero shot. Maybe we should attack guides for killing fish. Sounds pretty stupid doesn't it.

[Jake O]

I have my popcorn out. Carry on. This thread looks promissing.

[Fish Guru]

This post is getting real stupid with assumptions and personal feelings. If it is legal then let it be. Plenty of people feel that guides are killing fish every day by hooking and landing them so they can take the fish out of water to take that hero shot. Maybe we should attack guides for killing fish. Sounds pretty stupid doesn't it.

I Get where you are coming from Scott, it is just unfortunate that the ethical spearos who pushed this law through were shortsighted enough to not think of how damaging it could be. It is much easier to target large fish with a spear gun, and once the wrong kind of people realize this then they can do a lot of damage. Every snorkeler or scuba guy I've ever talked to tells me how close they can get to the big stripers, not really sure how some are saying it's not gonna be that easy to spear the big ones? Our declining striper fishery cannot handle another attack from yet another front, especially when you consider how many are already killed in the delta by harvesters. As I stated earlier, before this was legal I have seen poachers with spearguns with 2-4 stripers over 20 lbs on ropes dragging behind them. One guy got busted as he was meeting friends at various takeouts and offloading his catch to get more.
Sure it is legal, but another method of taking fish from the rivers is definitely not gonna help.

[WinterrunRon]

I have my popcorn out. Carry on. This thread looks promissing.

Damn, I've been wasting my time lurking over in the steelhead forum when all the action is right here! I almost missed this! :p

Please continue, I believe it's a spearos' turn to post a comment.


PS: Adding "spearos" to my dictionary. New word for me!

[OceanSunfish]

I Get where you are coming from Scott, it is just unfortunate that the ethical spearos who pushed this law through were shortsighted enough to not think of how damaging it could be. It is much easier to target large fish with a spear gun, and once the wrong kind of people realize this then they can do a lot of damage. Every snorkeler or scuba guy I've ever talked to tells me how close they can get to the big stripers, not really sure how some are saying it's not gonna be that easy to spear the big ones? Our declining striper fishery cannot handle another attack from yet another front, especially when you consider how many are already killed in the delta by harvesters. As I stated earlier, before this was legal I have seen poachers with spearguns with 2-4 stripers over 20 lbs on ropes dragging behind them. One guy got busted as he was meeting friends at various takeouts and offloading his catch to get more.
Sure it is legal, but another method of taking fish from the rivers is definitely not gonna help.


Well said by at least someone not willing to be content or complacent.

I hope that the regs can be redrawn soon to meet the requirements of the eithical sportfisherman (to include spearfisherman)..... and give LEO the parameters to enforce the law.

Just another example of the 38 million different "agendas" there are in this beaut of a State.

[wishnbfishn]

I was shad fishing the American near Howe this morning when I saw a guy with a spear gun and diving gear dragging two very large stripers behind him to his truck. I wasn't aware of this reg change until I called CalTip to report the offender. Now I see this thread while looking for striper reports. I don't post often, but I gotta say, this really saddens me.

Wishn

[Frank Alessio]

Which Senator from san fransicko was it that wanted to get rid of the Stripes...???

[STEELIES/26c3]

Which Senator from san fransicko was it that wanted to get rid of the Stripes...???

Senator Feinstein, Senator Boxer, Governor Brown, and a myriad of other crooked politicians who are given 6-figure campaign contributions by Stewart Resnick in exchange for helping him to push his water agenda (ie, building the peripheral canal, rewriting the regulations for take limits on striped bass, and even mapping out a plan for the extirpation of the striped bass fishery from the delta ecosystem)

I know this is old hat for anyone who knows anything about the politics surrounding our delta... but to repeat..

Resnick and Westland Water have in the past, cited striped bass predation as the leading reason for the declining numbers of salmon smolts, delta smelt, and other pelagic species in order to divert attention from the real culprit (increased water diversions from the Sac/SJ Delta) of which SURPRISE... politicians and Agribusiness Water Baron Primero Uno... Stew Resnick have a deep and involved financial interest...

Rather than spew what has already been spewed...

I invite you to check out the series of videos entitled, "Paper Water". Below is part 1 of a 4 part series:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1h8sAv0pQJU

Long live the West Coast Stripers!

[Frank Alessio]

Why do we keep these people in Office???

[Hatch]

Scott,
I do not know ANY fly fisherman (and I know a bunch) who would ever, on purpose, kill a large female striped bass for any reason.
HATCH

[winxp_man]

Why do we keep these people in Office???


Because we can't get enough of there sexy looks :D They are doing us lots of good........

[Fish Guru]

I was shad fishing the American near Howe this morning when I saw a guy with a spear gun and diving gear dragging two very large stripers behind him to his truck. I wasn't aware of this reg change until I called CalTip to report the offender. Now I see this thread while looking for striper reports. I don't post often, but I gotta say, this really saddens me.

Wishn

And this is precisely what some of us have been saying is going to happen. We are 2 days into it and this is already happening, over the course of the summer anyone that fishes the lower river will see the impact this has. As long as the shad are balled up down there the big girls will be easy pickings, and unfortunately this is the beginning of the run. One can can only hope for the water to come up soon to push the fish upriver where they are safe.

[DAVID95670]

Because we can't get enough of there sexy looks :D They are doing us lots of good........

now you want to steal my liberties next you liberals will want my guns ......dont tread on me!

[DAVID95670]

Why do we keep these people in Office???



we have rights in this country ....let me have my guns .... 45 acp or spear

[DAVID95670]

On a serious note (not crapping on my friends love guns but hate spear guns obvious oxymoron) ....but elimiating stripers from the American River would be a good this for native species these fish were never native....too bad they do not target Shad with the spear guns.

I like fishing for them as long as they are here and it is legal however from a naturist stand they are invasive species to the American....


i still want to take some steelhead eggs fertilize them and plant them up river of folsom lke it would be amazing to have a large population in the lake going up the american rivers what the hell

[winxp_man]

I have my popcorn out. Carry on. This thread looks promissing.


Screw the popcorn its smores time for this camp fire..... :)



http://rocketgrants.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/smores-doing-it-wrong-620x400.jpg

[Fish Guru]

On a serious note (not crapping on my friends love guns but hate spear guns obvious oxymoron) ....but elimiating stripers from the American River would be a good this for native species these fish were never native....too bad they do not target Shad with the spear guns.

I like fishing for them as long as they are here and it is legal however from a naturist stand they are invasive species to the American....


i still want to take some steelhead eggs fertilize them and plant them up river of folsom lke it would be amazing to have a large population in the lake going up the american rivers what the hell

Considering that the stripers have coexisted fine with the salmonids for over 100 years eliminating them isn't going to change the current salmon and steelhead situation. The salmon and steelhead that we do have now are convuluted versions of the native fish, as so many strains have been mixed by the hatcheries for many years. I'm sorry to bear the bad news, but the days of native salmon and steelhead thriving on the American River are long gone. Hatchery fish are the only reason we have any salmonids left to fish for, between water diversions, lack of spawning habitat and poor water quality reviving the native populations is not gonna happen. The current runs are supported by hatchery fish, which are not just American River based, so technically they would be considered non native as well( if you truly want to revive the native fish).
Eliminating the stripers will help nothing other than providing fewer oppurtunities for anglers, something that should be cherished by those who enjoy the diverse fishery we have in an urban setting.

[STEELIES/26c3]

IT IS ILLEGAL TO SPEARFISH ANYWHERE IN THE AMERICAN RIVER FROM HAZEL AVE TO DISCOVERY

I kind of suspected this but didn't want to open my mouth until I'd heard it directly from CA F&W.

Because the American River Parkway is under the auspices of PARK and Sacramento County Ordinance, their regulations governing firearms in the AR PKWY actually override the jurisdiction of the CDFW regulations which provision for spearfishing in freshwater.

Plain and simple, firearms of any kind are strictly prohibited in the American River Parkway and so it is indeed illegal to use or even possess a spear gun in any of the waters therein.

9.36.060 Firearms, Air Guns, and Other Weapons.
No person other than peace officers
in the discharge of their duties sh
all use, maintain, possess, fire, or
discharge any firearm, air gun, spring gun, bow and
arrow, slingshot, or any other weapon potentially
dangerous to wildlife or human safety, except in areas, at times, and under conditions designated by the
director for such use. A violation of the provisions
of this section is a misdemeanor. (SCC 576 § 15, 1983.)

I confirmed this with long time CDFW Game Warden, Allan Weingarten today.

SO Benny, next time, you'll need to educate Cal-Tip~;")

[Scott V]

except in areas, at times, and under conditions designated by the
director for such use.

This might be the part that allows spearguns. It has been designated that spearfishing is allowed on the river.

[STEELIES/26c3]

except in areas, at times, and under conditions designated by the
director for such use.
This might be the part that allows spearguns. It has been designated that spearfishing is allowed on the river.

Allan confirmed with the director that the above provision has no bearing... and confirmed with me that he would indeed gift any and all spearos in the parkway with a tidy ticket and a hefty fine...

I'm awaiting a call from the Sac County supervising ranger to confirm the above.

I believe they JUST had a meeting on this and rangers were debriefed within the last 48 hours.

[Randy B]

Not a lawyer, but I think that might refer to the Sac Co Parks Director not the CDFW Director.

[STEELIES/26c3]

Not a lawyer, but I think that might refer to the Sac Co Parks Director not the CDFW Director.

not sure what "that" refers to but Allan spoke with the head Sac County park ranger as well as the director of his own department.

It was inter-agency confirmation I was referring to above. Simply put, CDFW conferred with SCRPD and the end word was that it is illegal to spearfish in the American River. Cases will be treated as a misdemeanor punishable by law.

[Mike O]

Unless they enter the river from the Sac?

[Fish Guru]

Unless they enter the river from the Sac?
That doesn't make a bit of a difference, you'd still be in the parkway and the American River so you'd still be in violation. Doesn't matter how you got there, whether via the Sac or by helicopter, you would still be in the American and in violation of the law.
Thanks for the clarification on what I was suspecting as well Mark; hopefully they post signs before any more damage is done.

[STEELIES/26c3]

Unless they enter the river from the Sac?

I considered that also before I typed~;)

and whereas that may fly regarding access via high water mark in public trust Doctrine/fishing on 'private property' issues... happily, it don't fly here~

You're welcome FG

We're still on the same team~;)
M

[STEELIES/26c3]

I just got off the phone with the SCRPD supervising ranger, Stan Lumsden who confirmed for me that, as already stated... it is 100% illegal to spearfish from Hazel AVE to the confluence at Discovery Park.

Needless to say, there will be poachers pleading ignorance... but the more we mention and discuss it on boards like this, the harder it will be for violators to use the "didn't understand the reg's argument).

I doubt we'll see any signs posted due to budget constraints of the county and state and the lack of any REAL CDFW support for striped bass...

[Tony Buzolich]

This is great if it can be enforced and monitored. I think it would be a good news article in the Sacramento Bee about how numerous fishermen are trying to protect fish in the parkway.

Hmmmm? Maybe I'll give them a call right now :)
Tony

[Fish Guru]

yes we are Mark..
Tony, unfortunately nothing can be done to keep them off of the Feather, but this is a start at least. Unfortunately for your home waters there may be even more of them since they can't do it here.
I was browsing the spearfishing forums and guys are all jazzed up about spearing the rivers, especially the American. It's funny how they were bummed that the big ones they saw while scouting pre season eluded them on the "opener", something that we were told wasn't the kind of fish these guys would be targeting.
If anyone has the time, word of this being against the law on the American should be posted on the spear fishing sites so they can be aware of the fact that it is illegal on the American. They already have pics of fish from the Howe stretch on one site and had a report of a 48" fish being killed as well. I'm trying to join onto this site to let them know, I'm sure my posts will be embraced with open arms. :)

[Dan Harrison]

IT IS ILLEGAL TO SPEARFISH ANYWHERE IN THE AMERICAN RIVER FROM HAZEL AVE TO DISCOVERY

I kind of suspected this but didn't want to open my mouth until I'd heard it directly from CA F&W.

Because the American River Parkway is under the auspices of PARK and Sacramento County Ordinance, their regulations governing firearms in the AR PKWY actually override the jurisdiction of the CDFW regulations which provision for spearfishing in freshwater.

Plain and simple, firearms of any kind are strictly prohibited in the American River Parkway and so it is indeed illegal to use or even possess a spear gun in any of the waters therein.

9.36.060 Firearms, Air Guns, and Other Weapons.
No person other than peace officers
in the discharge of their duties sh
all use, maintain, possess, fire, or
discharge any firearm, air gun, spring gun, bow and
arrow, slingshot, or any other weapon potentially
dangerous to wildlife or human safety, except in areas, at times, and under conditions designated by the
director for such use. A violation of the provisions
of this section is a misdemeanor. (SCC 576 § 15, 1983.)

I confirmed this with long time CDFW Game Warden, Allan Weingarten today.

SO Benny, next time, you'll need to educate Cal-Tip~;")


Thanks Steelie for doing some research and calls. Very good news indeed. I figure if (when) I see one I will be going past cal-tip and calling 911 and expressing my concern for weapon use in the parkway.

[Darian]

Are the photos of speared Stripers from the American River or another prohibited water??? If so, it seems to me that it's evidence of a violation and usable in court.... Of course, the problem of making the connections from the photo might be tough. Should be enough for CalTip, tho.

At any rate, posting information on spearos websites is probably better at this point.

[Fish Guru]

Are the photos of speared Stripers from the American River or another prohibited water??? If so, it seems to me that it's evidence of a violation and usable in court.... Of course, the problem of making the connections from the photo might be tough. Should be enough for CalTip, tho.

At any rate, posting information on spearos websites is probably better at this point.

One of the photos I saw was just upstream of the H street bridge, and was taken on 5-1. Can't seem to find the other one I saw earlier of the big fish. I doubt it's worth the trouble of going after them for those, but I honestly just want to join some sites to inform them that what they're doing is illegal and it would be best advised to spearfish elsewhere. Im still waiting for my new accounts to be approved so I can get this matter out there. They aren't gonna like it but its simply not allowed and they need to be informed. I imagine many will dispute what I say, so I will refer to this thread and possibly give out the American river parkway ranger phone number.
It can't possibly cost much at all for the rangers and or fish and game to post some improvised signs stating that it is illegal at various access points on the lower river, I sure hope they do something like this to stop these activities ASAP.

[Ed Wahl]

Steelies, you're my new hero. You cut out the crap and went to a real source. Well done. Ed

[OceanSunfish]

Great work.

[STEELIES/26c3]

I think the Facebook 48" striper photo was removed from the guy's facebook page because he didn't want the incriminating link...

I'm going to play devil's advocate here and say this...

As much as I don't like the idea of spearfishing stripers in freshwater, I am even more concerned about our rights as citizens and sportsmen and sportswomen...

I don't think the spearos are the enemy. I happen to know a few who are very stand-up sportsmen and also have mixed feelings about the newly-passed regulations...

Without a long-winded dissertation, I would kindly remind fly guys, gear guys, harvesters, and strictly CNR folks alike... that we must not lose sight of the bigger picture and who the true adversaries are...

Here's an excerpt and a quote from an insightful member of Spearboard.com:

I heard it (the reg drop) almost did, actually, or at least was called for. However, my friend who's a fisheries biologist for dfg who told me this, said that the whole striper reg change thing in general is kind of a double edged sword/bitter pill-that it's kinda cool for us that they changed the regs, but actually one of if not THE, main reason they did so was not... because of us. It was because of the lobbying of certain parties who want to demonize and/or eradicate the Striper in hopes of diverting attention away from and preserving their massive water interests (depletion/extraction/ theft?) in the delta for sending south, which is a very real and obvious (not theoretical) threat to those salmon smoltshttp://www.spearboard.com/images/smilies/cool.gif Many things are not what they seem when it comes to government (politics). We saw/learned this with the MLPA BS. Money talks and the government works for those that have it and throw it around. Who is it that said, you find who would benefit (monetarily) and usually, you have your culprit..or something to that extent? Well guess what? They were right. Unfortunately.

Tougher times ahead,

Stay unified, and FIGHT, FIGHT, FIGHT

[Randy Lee]

I'm with Ed, GO STEELIES! But I'm still a 49er fan too.

[mar]

Right on Steelies. Thank you for taking the time to get the right info and sharing with us. Hopefully not too much harm has been done.