"High Stick" nymphing in the 1960s and 70s

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

Many years ago I started into the retail fishing tackle business, ~1965.

Back then in our top quality sporting goods store in Sacramento (not many fly shops then) we had mostly dry flies, classic wet flies and classic streamers. Not too many nymphs yet.....

Well, up north in Dunsmuir, California on the Upper Sacramento River fly fisher, guide and fly shop owner Ted Fay was pioneering high stick nymphing with two heavily weighted nymphs.

Others like native American Ted Towndally were also pioneering this "new" technique.

Our Cortland Line Company Rep Joe Patterson and my old friend Neil Hansen actually got us "younger guys" started in that short line, high stick, upstream, pocket water nymphing technique.

Jerry Lyerly of Sacramento was one of the first guys I met who was upstream nymphing about 40 years ago.

I know this is going to shock some but this was before indicators came along. All this was without indicators, for the most part.

Some did put something on the line like fingernail polish where they had whipped a loop in the end of their fly line. Something to watch....

We used the Cortland Peach line which was light colored and we merely watch the end of it to detect the subtle stops.

Well, we got started, mostly my brother Dick and I, on the Pit River.

After a few years we got pretty good at it but it did take us a few years to get going because there was not much help in that era.

We got so good at catching fish with weighted nymphs upstream, high stick nymphing that we bragged about not even carrying dry flies.

OK, this was a dark period for me, we made fun of those who had not yet discovered upstream, pocket water, high stick nymphing who only dry fly fished. We were bad guys once too.

We had one fly box of weighted nymphs (wet flies too), an extra leader, some split shot and one spool of heavy tippet material (2x?).

Our nymphs were mostly Hares Ears and black APs in #8, 10 and 12......we used no small nymphs back then in big free stone rivers.

If you want to get acquainted with classic high stick nymphing then go out for a day with Bill Carnazzo who is still promoting, guiding and teaching this technique.

I can remember in maybe the 1980s when indicators came on the scene. I remember putting some in my vest because I thought I had better learn how to use them if I was going to sell them in my fly shop.

Old timers which are guys like Darian and I have seen lots of things come and go in this sport over the passed half a century......

The real old timers that really pioneered this sport are all but gone now. They were the great generation who were the age of my parents. They were pretty lucky because they had averagely much better fishing for everything back in their day.

[BillB]

Ahhh, those were the days. We also cut different lengths of lead core trolling line, the kind with a fabric covering, from one to five feet in length with simple loops on each end. I had a FF76 I worked long and saved for complete with Pfluger Medalist that really couldn't cast the concoction, just lobbed it into the likely pocket. Funny how things progress, I hated the lead core because it wasn't as much fun as a full floater. Now I have at least four different fast sinkers!

[Woodman]

Although I didn't start quite as early as Bill, even when I began fly fishing in the early 1980s, I caught a LOT of fish on the Black Bomber...I could tie it reasonably well with my limited fly tying skills, and size 10 and 12 worked fine. My first indicators were a short length of orange Amnesia tied into a knotted leader made from Maxima mono. On a crowded day on the upper Sac I'd see at least two or three people.

[Troutstalker55B]

Great post Bill! My Dad was one of those pioneers of high sticking back then but he called it "short lining". Once you learn it you can call yourself a zen master because you know when to set the hook without any clues - You just know. My favorite place to use this technique is on the Madison river around the 3$ bridge area. Good times!

Jon.

[Darian]

Since Bill classified me as an official ol' timer, I guess I oughta see if I can recall this subject. I started deep nymphing on Putah Creek in the late '60s. missed a lot of takes unless I fished a heavily weighted wooly worm. Then, the takes were solid. No indicators. Wasn't very consistent (due to the lack of skill of the operator). :confused:

I heard about Ted fay from others in the bay area and started reading about how he fished. For some reason, I didn't try the high stick, short, tight line method until around 1975 when I fished the upper Sacramento for the first time. It was a real eye opener and I've been a devotee ever since. The heavily weighted flies and short line didn't require a cast as much as a lob. Most of the time the leader and flies were the only part of the equipment in the water. The rod was one that I built on a Lamiglas 8.5' yellow glass blank and (like BillB) a Pflueger Medalist reel. Slow action rod.... Great outfit. :D

Wading deep (up to the armpits deep) gives a chance to cover more productive water as most of the really deep holes are around midstream rocks. Tough to do that any longer (too many aches/pains).... But, I do recall hooking two Trout on a cast on more than one occasion using this method. It also works in deeper pocket water during the late summer and fall. :cool:

I really like the flies produced by Ted Towendolly and Ted Fay. There's even been some additions by succesors (the late Larry Green and Joe Kimsey). So simple, yet so effective.... :D

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

Thanks Darina

Trying to remember if we used knot-less tapered leaders or just tied up something simple with Maxima?

I do know that back then we use the two fly dropper system that those old guys developed.

I would put my split shot above the dropper junction so it would not slide down the leader.

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The old "Bombers" are still available at the Ted Fay Fly Shop in Dunsmuir, CA. They were heavily weighted simple wet flies on a short heavy hook. Maybe the Mustad 3908 or the 7957BX.

The Black and the Brown Bombers seem to be very popular. I think back then it was in #8 and 10 sizes.

The Black Bomber had a Grizzly hackle tail or was it mallard flank? Black wool yard or dubbing, and a Grizzly hackle collar.

In the 1960s Ted Towndally, native American fly fishier and fly tier, came to Sports Unlimited in Sacramento were I was working looking for Grizzly hackle capes.

He told me about his fishing style and special heavy Bomber flies. After some time he went out to his car and brought in a 3 pound coffee can filled 3/4 of the way with Black Bombers. The can weighed so much I could barely hold it. He wanted to know if we wanted to buy some but I told him I didn't know if we would sell them down here?

__________________________________________________ __________________________

My real exposure to this high stick nymphing was when I was vacationing in Dunsmuir one summer in the 1960s and I met a student of Ted Fay's at the park on the river in town behind the baseball diamonds. He was there with his family upstream nymphing with that high stick, short line technique. I told him I had heard about it but had never seen it in person.

He said he was up there some years ago and watched Ted Fay with a guide customer catching fish on almost every cast. The next day he went out with Ted and was instantly hooked.

He invited me to go out the next day with him. It was August which is not the best time. We went up to Cantera Loop above town and he got one 18" wild hot Rainbow trout which was enough for me.

He was using a Fenwick fiberglass 2 piece 8'6" #7 fly rod with a Pflueger Medalist 1495 fly reel. He had on a Scientific Angler Air Cell WF7F that was dark mahogany in color with a 2 inch spot at the end of the line where he had whipped a loop and painted it with white finger nail polish. That was the first "indicator" I had ever seen.

[Bruce Slightom]

I had the opportunity to fish with Ted a few times. He liked to use a ten foot eight weight rod with a ten foot leader. He said that if the fly line was touching the water you were casting too far.

Wading was the way to cover the water. I was about 20 and he was about 75 and I had a hard time keeping up with him. He wanted to fish up stream and passed up the runs and flats for the most part. I still use the wading staff that he showed me.

The way Ted fished is a lot like czech nymphing, bring the flies downstream a little faster than the current. He would look for a flash of the trout as he hooked more fish by seeing them than feeling them.

One of my favorite flies that he developed is Crow Fly.

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

Cool Bruce...

I never met Ted but I think we saw him on the Pit River once.

**The 'Black Bomber Spent Wing' looked a lot like a 'Silver Hilton' Steelhead fly?

[Darian]

The leader I used for that type fishing was around 7.5' with a tippet of around 2'. The tag would be approximately 1' to 1.5' for the dropper fly. I always used a stout tippet. The length of the dropper was important as in high stick, short lining both flies needed to ride at the same depth but not tangle too much. 8-)

I do recall that you could buy tapered leaders from Berkeley or Cortland at that time. Later, Scientific Anglers (3M) came up with their version of a tapered leader. Otherwise, you had to tie up your own. As I recall, Berkeley tapered leaders came in some very heavy butt sections tapering to whatever pound test you wanted. Cortland made a two part tapered leader; a heavy butt section with two or three extra tippet sections for knotting to the butt. The material was a dark green color. These things all sold for around $1.50. Berkeley leaders sold for around a $1.00. :nod:

I had no personal favorites. Whether I used a commercial leader or one of my own was generally a matter of convenience. Fishing in estuaries, made that an easy choice as during the course of several tide changes, the water could be clear or murky.... :D

[Bruce Slightom]

Ted used Mustad 7948A hooks, odd number sizes like 7's 5's that he special ordered. The Black and Red Bombers were his ant initiations. When the carpenter ants were out he said that that was like candy or a drug to the fish.

[Larry S]

This is a great discussion. Thank you, gents!
Larry S

[Dave E.]

For those who may not have any idea what the patterns these guys are talking about, might have looked like.....

[royewest]

My new desktop background, thanks!

(Replaces Gordon L.'s bead head nymph for now.)

[BillB]

I don't know about you other "older gentlemen" out there but we didn't wear waders often either. First we couldn't afford an nice pair of rubber or nylon waders and resorted to vinyl, a few bucks, waders when we absolutely felt it necessary. Second the nature of the game was to keep moving to new water so waders were actually a hindrance. Through the brush, over boulders and very dangerous swims across the river. Heck, I have the joints to verify all that tom-foolery! Wouldn't change a thing.

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

Thanks 'Dave E'....we had one of those charts around here some years ago.

Thanks 'BillB'.....my brother Dick and I didn't wear waders on the Pit River in the fall either. We swam the river some too.

When I saw "A River Runs Through It" for the first time I thought of my brother and I on the Pit River.

I just hope I can still wade the Pit, slowly, with my grandkids.

[Frank Alessio]

Bill,

Not to change the Subject but.... I fished the Upper Sac Monday at 10:00 am.. The fish were coming uo top for Large Salmon Flys. The wind was Blowing hard. I fished long enough to get my FIX... It did not take long I was returning from Steelhead fishing on the Grand Rhonde..... White tail hunting in MW Montana... Mule Deer, Coyotes and Antelope in SE Montana.... What a trip.....

Frank

[koffler]

Nice thread -

Frank - Hoping to get what you got; heading to southern Montana tomorrow for 10 days; this time of year we typically shoot a lot of coyotes and antelope. Also looking for a few whitetails and have a turkey hunt throw-in. The remaining days will find my on the Bighorn - will post an update when I return.

Jason

[Frank Alessio]

Jason,

I hope you also have a good time...

Frank

[pgw]

I had the opportunity to fish with Ted a few times. He liked to use a ten foot eight weight rod with a ten foot leader. He said that if the fly line was touching the water you were casting too far.

Wading was the way to cover the water. I was about 20 and he was about 75 and I had a hard time keeping up with him. He wanted to fish up stream and passed up the runs and flats for the most part. I still use the wading staff that he showed me.

The way Ted fished is a lot like czech nymphing, bring the flies downstream a little faster than the current. He would look for a flash of the trout as he hooked more fish by seeing them than feeling them.

One of my favorite flies that he developed is Crow Fly.

I met a former Yankee 2nd Baseman in Ted's shop for whom I believe the Cro fly was named...a very effective pattern that I've used with success anywhere there are stoneflies or caddis.

And I can still here Ted telling me, "keep the rod up, don't let the flyline stay on the water!"

Paul

[pgw]

I don't know about you other "older gentlemen" out there but we didn't wear waders often either. First we couldn't afford an nice pair of rubber or nylon waders and resorted to vinyl, a few bucks, waders when we absolutely felt it necessary. Second the nature of the game was to keep moving to new water so waders were actually a hindrance. Through the brush, over boulders and very dangerous swims across the river. Heck, I have the joints to verify all that tom-foolery! Wouldn't change a thing.

I felt like a wimp wearing my Seal-drys or the "new" lightweight RedBall's when I fished with Ted Fay and Roy Haile in Dunsmuir...those two were in their 70's and waded wet wearing Olive Green jumpsuits and Weinbrenner wading shoes...makes me shiver just to think about them wading wet on cold mornings in October.

Paul

[thekid]

Bill,

Not to change the Subject but.... I fished the Upper Sac Monday at 10:00 am.. The fish were coming uo top for Large Salmon Flys. The wind was Blowing hard. I fished long enough to get my FIX... It did not take long I was returning from Steelhead fishing on the Grand Rhonde..... White tail hunting in MW Montana... Mule Deer, Coyotes and Antelope in SE Montana.... What a trip.....

Frank

Hard to imagine salmon flys in this weather. Never seen it. had to be october caddis. amazing year for them!

[Frank Alessio]

How big do October Caddis get???These were bigger than any case I have seen in the river bottom... The fish were eating an Orange stimulator. The baseball player was Frank Crosetti...Hence the Crow Fly...