More success at Davis Lake in Nor Cal

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

Email from a friend:

Hi Bill;

Just fished Davis for two days – We really smoked ‘em. Fished mostly off Camp five point with itty bitty stuff. Conventional streamers and nymphs were not nearly as productive.

Regards, John

[B Kane]

Great to hear Davis is Smoking good. Have one question about the condition of the fish. How bad are the parasites on those fish? I've heard that some of them are pretty bad.

[michaeln]

Of the fish I have caught at Davis this year, 75% of them were copepod infested. How bad? I don't know, both sides of the fish had sores and copepods, that's pretty bad in my book.

One is bad, more is disgusting.

[1flyfisher]

When I was up there I had heard that there were more fish and better fishing at Jenkins/Camp 5. I just stayed at cow with a few guys I know. I fished fugawee, cow and freeman. It was painfully slow with few bugs. I fished with some good fisherman this past week. A few of the best flyfisherman I know sash and jim moloney. Ask sash how it was, we did poorly. So did some other very good fishermen. It picked up a tiny bit on fri.
The bugs will come off and the fish will be eating them. What quality fish has yet to be seen. I hope I catch what I consider the usual quality of fish I have caught for a few decades @ davis and that is clean, fat beautiful rainbows 17"+. I am getting tired of the dinks but they are better than nothing. Little fish are better than no fish but.....I hope some nice fish show up this season. This is year 3 post nuke and the trout population should be kicking out this quality of fish.

I would like to know what CADFG is doing to get us there and if they have an explanation for the parasites?????? I guess they say this is normal for a lake. First time I've seen or heard of it in any sierra's lakes. Anyone seen this before? I was an aquarist for a long time in the past and I know that these parasites and problems are much more common to aquariums, koi ponds, hatcheries. Not lakes. I've never seen it in lakes. Just wondering. I'd like to know the current fish population. CADFG hasn't been stocking it as much as it has been in the past. They are below average in their stocking. Stable water levels and high water levels are nice. This lake always snaps back. It will get there. Weed beds will fill in the lake in time and that is usually just a fast one season. If they don't drop it much we will get to max pool next winter with an average winter. That would be nice. I like max pool to the current level. There is LOTS of great water in davis now. very happy about that.

I hope we have some decent hatches. Usually in high water years you can get some nice midge fishing. I have my fingers crossed for a good damsel hatch. We shall see.

[michaeln]

A guy on another board emailed the California F&G and received this response:

We are aware of the situation at Lake Davis. We examined a number of trout from Lake Davis to confirm the identity the organisms being seen. We found light to heavy numbers of copepods on the fish. The majority of the fish lice we observed were of the genus Salmincola. There may be a few of the genus Lernaea as well.

Common names for these copepods are “anchor worm, fish maggot” etc. The organisms found on these particular fish are commonly found in waters throughout the western United States. This organism usually does not affect fish health, though its appearance on fish can be unattractive. The presence of this organism on fish does not render the fish unfit for human consumption. It is not an internal parasite, but rather infects the gills, fins and flanks of susceptible species of fish. There are no practical treatment options available for lakes and reservoirs.

The increased numbers of these organisms being seen this year is most likely due the warming of the water and the high number of fish planted into Lake Davis. The organisms were already in Lake Davis. When Fish and Game planted the large number of trout into the lake we provided a large number of hosts for the parasite to live on and multiply from.

The copepod numbers will decline with cooling water temperatures and decreasing fish numbers.

[michaeln]

I don't understand what they said about it being caused by the warming of the water. Davis has been COLDER than normal, not warmer. That leaves the increased plants, which is what many of us have suspected anyway.

I think the DFG is blowing hot air up our nether regions.

[Troutstalker55B]

Those fish ARE playing small ball! Today we got into 13, 11 to the boat on a #20 green midge on 6x during the hatch in the morning. I have never fished a fly so small or tippet so light at the lake, but when you see fish coming up and eating a half dozen at a time - it's time to re think the whole game. I still think that the damsels will come off at some point, it's a waiting game. As for the parasites, DGF needs to do away with the smoke and mirrors and come up with some solutions - It's bad.

Jon.

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

I think the Rainbow trout in Klamath Lake have this same parasites for many decades.

[1flyfisher]

I hope they go away soon.


A guy on another board emailed the California F&G and received this response:

We are aware of the situation at Lake Davis. We examined a number of trout from Lake Davis to confirm the identity the organisms being seen. We found light to heavy numbers of copepods on the fish. The majority of the fish lice we observed were of the genus Salmincola. There may be a few of the genus Lernaea as well.

I identified the copepods as Ergasilus which is the most numerous parasite on the trout I have seen.

Common names for these copepods are “anchor worm, fish maggot” etc. The organisms found on these particular fish are commonly found in waters throughout the western United States. Yes they are, that is true but they don't outbreak enmasse in lakes. This organism usually does not affect fish health, though its appearance on fish can be unattractive. Parasites of this nature are NOT a good thing to have for any type of fish whether they are in a fish tank or a lake. Although they don't kill their host, they weaken immunity and cause a host of other problems. One of which is Sores cause a LOSS of body fluids which you can imagine doesn't help enhance the fish with strength and vitality. If I had a tank, koi pond etc I would treat the water immediately to rid the water of them. The presence of this organism on fish does not render the fish unfit for human consumption. It is not an internal parasite, but rather infects the gills, fins and flanks of susceptible species of fish. Anchor worms bore into the meat of the fish and leaves a sore. I won't be eating any of them. My friend did, he said they were ok. He skinned them too. There are no practical treatment options available for lakes and reservoirs. True. But I suspect the infection originated from a hatchery. Just my opinion from what I know of fish aquaculture and lake environments and these types of parasites. I could very well be wrong, but until I find accurate confirmation I will continue to question DFG's claims.

The increased numbers of these organisms being seen this year is most likely due the warming of the water and the high number of fish planted into Lake Davis.
This could be true do to lower water levels but the claim of high numbers of fish is questionable.....If you look at the numbers that have been planted they are much lower than what is planted in an average stocking year over the history of the lake. The DFG's initial claims that they would stock millions of fish where never met. And were wild bs anyway.

The organisms were already in Lake Davis. When Fish and Game planted the large number of trout into the lake we provided a large number of hosts for the parasite to live on and multiply from.
They have planted fish for decades in the lake. In small and large numbers. This has never happened before. Of course there is a first time for everything. Has this ever happened in any sierra trout lake?

The copepod numbers will decline with cooling water temperatures and decreasing fish numbers.

We have had 2 very unusually cold spring/summers in a row. So far the parasites are still there and they seem to be on small 12-14" recent planters.

[1flyfisher]

I don't understand what they said about it being caused by the warming of the water. Davis has been COLDER than normal, not warmer. That leaves the increased plants, which is what many of us have suspected anyway.

I think the DFG is blowing hot air up our nether regions.

This year the spring has been colder than normal. last year was the coldest spring/summer I have ever experienced in a few decades on davis. BUT The water was very low, swampy, very weeded out and I imagine warmed up quite a bit in july and august at higher then normal temperatures. I wasn't taking water temps but the overall water quality was poor and if you know the history of lake davis it has had lots of problems with water quality and fish survivability. So their claim has some merit.

[michaeln]

Don Rotsma has an encouraging report on his site:

http://www.flyfishwithdon.com/fishreport.htm

[jayclarkflyfishing]

While the damsels may start coming off, in my opinion the water will be TOO warm to safely catch and release trout.70 degree surface temps are already too warm.I have a couple of trips this week but I will be done guiding the lake until the fall when temps come back down.Bugs or no bugs...

As far as the copopods are concerned they suck and I would like to know why they are infecting fish in Prosser this year as well.Coming from the hatchery?Come on DFG give us the real answers and not what you think we may want to hear!End rant...

Jay

[michaeln]

I have no plans to return to Davis until the fall either. I agree with you about the water temps being too warm for safe C&R.

[Jgoding]

Last year where we fish where the river (Mccloud) flows into Shasta, a lot of those fish had copepods as well. Never saw those until a few years ago in that area as well but fish were heavily infested in my opinion.

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

For many years the place that was famous for "ugly looking fish" was Klamath Lake in southern Oregon.

Sad to hear they are getting into more fisheries now.

[SHigSpeed]

What's the current water temp at Davis?

_SHig

[michaeln]

What's the current water temp at Davis?

_SHig

According to Don as of yesterday it was 70 degrees Fahrenheit.

[gene goss]

The P H and (dissolved oxygen) is the killer...a surface temp. of 70 degrees is high (what time of the day was that measured)....lets say that for every ft. of water depths, the temp. goes down 1 degree (5ft. of water 65 degree)...(10ft. of water 60 degree)....trout will go to the surface for food then back down to the cooler water...so what does all this mean....the surface temp. in the morning will increase 1 degree for every hr. of sunlight....if your going to fish, start at sunrise (6am), and stop fishing the surface by 10am....after 10am move toooooo the deep channels between the weed beds (8ft to 10ft) of water.....by noon you should stop fishing...right at sundown there use to be a blood midge hatch, that we would fish....if your going to fish use a heavy tippet (8lbs)...barbless hooks....keep the fish in the water (no pictures)....this not the time to see how many fish you can catch....slow down and enjoy....does anyone know if Davis Lake ever had a algae bloom?????

[jayclarkflyfishing]

Yes, Davis suffers from algae blooms.While not as bad(that I have experienced) as Heenan or Crowley they do happen.

Here is a link to an interesting study about water temps and lethality for rainbow trout.

http://www.70degreepledge.org/APDEA_AttachmentITroutTemperatureRequirements.pdf

IMNSHO, the water temps are getting to high to safely catch and release trout.Another week or two and it will be over until the fall.

Jay

[SHigSpeed]

According to Don as of yesterday it was 70 degrees Fahrenheit.

That's very surprising! June average temps so far has only been 58 and May was 45. I know that radiation heating from sunlight is a big part of the heating of the water but wow! Is the water murky? This'll make it warm faster...

_SHig

[michaeln]

I saw lots of mid to high 60s when I was up there two weeks ago, so I have no trouble believing it's up to 70 now. In fact today was another hot day and all this week air temps are supposed pretty warm too. I can't see that doing anything but making the water temperature climb even higher than it is now.

[gene goss]

Yes, Davis suffers from algae blooms.While not as bad(that I have experienced) as Heenan or Crowley they do happen.

Here is a link to an interesting study about water temps and lethality for rainbow trout.

http://www.70degreepledge.org/APDEA_AttachmentITroutTemperatureRequirements.pdf

IMNSHO, the water temps are getting to high to safely catch and release trout.Another week or two and it will be over until the fall.

Jay

Jay thanks for posting that web. site 70 degree pledge....there's some good info. in all that....correct me if I'm wrong....are they talking about a constant temp. from the surface to the bottom of the lake ??????.....ideal temp. for rainbow is 20 c (less than 66 f), and the kill temp is 29 c (84.5 f)....also with the extra waten in Davis this year (i haven't been up there this spring) is there more shallow water flats to heat up?????? would i be correct in saying that when the water temp. goes up the trout will move off the flats to cooler waters....would it be safer to fish for them in the deeper, colder water???? sorry for all the questions

[michaeln]

Even the deeper, cooler water is going to be warmer on top, and on top is where most of the fight with a trout will take place.

[michaeln]

June average temps so far has only been 58

Where did you get that data from?

[jayclarkflyfishing]

Jay thanks for posting that web. site 70 degree pledge....there's some good info. in all that....correct me if I'm wrong....are they talking about a constant temp. from the surface to the bottom of the lake ??????.....ideal temp. for rainbow is 20 c (less than 66 f), and the kill temp is 29 c (84.5 f)....also with the extra waten in Davis this year (i haven't been up there this spring) is there more shallow water flats to heat up?????? would i be correct in saying that when the water temp. goes up the trout will move off the flats to cooler waters....would it be safer to fish for them in the deeper, colder water???? sorry for all the questions


Yes there are more shallow flats to heat up this year.People can (and will) fish deeper but bringing the fish into warmer water will cause harm in my opinion.The report also said that some ELT have shown a higher tolerance for warmer water.

Gotta run,off to the lake for a trip.I'll report on current water temps tonight.

Jay

[SHigSpeed]

Where did you get that data from?

http://www.wunderground.com/weatherstation/WXDailyHistory.asp?ID=KCAGRAEA1&day=29&year=2010&month=6&graphspan=month

_SHig

[michaeln]

http://www.wunderground.com/weatherstation/WXDailyHistory.asp?ID=KCAGRAEA1&day=29&year=2010&month=6&graphspan=month


Ah, OK. I thought you were talking about average WATER temperatures, and I didn't know that was available anywhere.

[B Kane]

I read Don Rosthma's report about the damsels starting and the great fishing expected right now. I also read that the temps are too high now and catch and release would be lethal to the fish. I'm having a hard time deciding between good fishing and harming the fish. Any advice?

[Scott V]

I read Don Rosthma's report about the damsels starting and the great fishing expected right now. I also read that the temps are too high now and catch and release would be lethal to the fish. I'm having a hard time deciding between good fishing and harming the fish. Any advice?

I personally would go and catch a fish or two and if they are having a hard time swimming away then I would stop fishing, but if the fish are having no problem swimming away and are very active then fish on.

[Ed Wahl]

I read Don Rosthma's report about the damsels starting and the great fishing expected right now. I also read that the temps are too high now and catch and release would be lethal to the fish. I'm having a hard time deciding between good fishing and harming the fish. Any advice?

You can catch 5, enjoy the fight, admire the colors and fitness of the fish, them bonk 'em and eat them that night.
Campfire trout are always the best.

Ed

[jayclarkflyfishing]

Saw plenty of adult damsels flying around but no swimmers or fish working them in the shallows.Water temps hit 72 degrees on the north end of the lake but was in the 68 degree range on the south end.

Had another solid day fishing midges in 10-11' of water.Fish were also caught on buggers and sheep creeks on a clear camo line.Largest fish of the day was a hook jawed brute that was right around 4#, but most were cookie cutter 14" fish.

My advice is to horse fish in and spend time reviving spent fish.As far as eating these fish,I don't know.The copepods are highly unappetizing.

Jay

[OceanSunfish]

Saw plenty of adult damsels flying around but no swimmers or fish working them in the shallows.Water temps hit 72 degrees on the north end of the lake but was in the 68 degree range on the south end.

Had another solid day fishing midges in 10-11' of water.Fish were also caught on buggers and sheep creeks on a clear camo line.Largest fish of the day was a hook jawed brute that was right around 4#, but most were cookie cutter 14" fish.

My advice is to horse fish in and spend time reviving spent fish.As far as eating these fish,I don't know.The copepods are highly unappetizing.

Jay

Thanks for keeping us updated on Davis Lake. Given with what the 'lake' has had to work with after the treatment a few years ago, it's doing good.... I think the testimony is in the fish's ability to endure adversity given the circumstances, therefore, the lake is set up to be the perfect trophy trout water with all it's fish food, habitat, and weather patterns. WE all know what the lake is capable of providing if given just a half a chance.

It's sickening that Lester Snow and the rest of the con artists at the various State agencies can affect everything right on up to Davis Lake. Just sickening.

[michaeln]

The latest Davis report from Don is pretty dismal:

http://www.flyfishwithdon.com/fishreport.htm

[Troutstalker55B]

OceanSunfish,

Lester Snow.......That says it all! If you want to hear a rant just email my dad at rbaiocchi@gotsky.com - he could share a thing or two on the matter! (LOL).

Jon.