pyramid lake combat

[kredmond1]

Hey guys, i'm a local dude at the lake fished there for 30 years and am having some issues with out of town so called sportsmen. FIshed yesterday and fishing was slow, so i spent some time on the beach talking to some of my buddies who told me the santa clara fly club had showed up in mass on that beach earlier in the day. i went to the far end of the beach and fished with a friend. fishing was dead most of the day after lunch started to pick up some fish. in the afternoon one of my friends had to leave so i moved to his spot. this left a gap of 200 ft. between myself and the next guy on the line(santa clara homeboy). because i was catching some fish this guy felt it was necessary to move 20 ft. from me trying to crowd me or make me move. i dont like to beat up old stupid fishermen so i packed up and left. The point is, folks, its a big lake with lots of room and lots of fish don't crowd others and use your best manners. if you want a local (like me) to give you any valid info at all, better be on your best behavior. i'm sure that no fisherman from kienes engage in this, but please pass this info on to your friends, thanks kurt.

[mark]

we had someone do the same exact thing to my buddy. Left a very large gap (150 feet) between us and the only other group at the beach. Wouldn't you know it one guy from their group decides he needs to fish in my buddies lap as he was catching fish. Then he wants to know what flies were using........ HA!!!! Fat chance bud, show some respect.

Went and found a desolate beach later...... still caught plenty. Had fun seeking out the smaller beaches, I try to find a new one every time up. Good way to explore the lake.

[Scott V]

Kurt, have you sent an email to the Santa Clara Club letting them know of their improper etiquette. It might be a good idea. You have to remember that alot of people are use to fishing real close to one another and may not have known that they were being rude. You might think it is rude to be that close to another person, but others might have not though about that. What if their only other experience has been fishing with their club, which has no problem fishing close to one another. Take for instance shad fishing, a very common place to have people right next to you fishing on both sides. I agree people should leave space, but if they are not told they may never learn.

[1flyfisher]

At the nets I have seen people 20 feet from one another many times.
I think in your situation as you explained it 20 feet is not an acceptable distance.
You were catching fish and this guy came right smack on top of you. Had he come say 50? 60? then maybe that would be ok with me (IF I was you) but I'd still think it was cheesy and pretty weak.

Why didn't you ask him nicely and politely to move?

On a regular lake I require 80-100 feet(it varies on the situation) as my casting ability with a 6wt is max 80 feet. If someone violates that distance they will be politely asked to move a bit further away. If they respond inappropriately they will be dealt with.

At pyramid I don't mind people squeezing in, you have to expect that. As long as it isn't too close for safety reasons then I don't care. If it creates a casting/safety issue then that is too close.
But when a beach is open like you had and you are the one catching fish and this guy climbs on top of you because he sees you catching fish ....well.....that is pretty weak.

[mk4]

If you're 200 feet or so from the line, then coming 20 feet next to you is inappropriate. But if you're in the line, I think 20 feet is acceptable.

I have issues with fly clubs coming down in large groups and taking over large chunks of river or lakes. It's bad etiquette and as a club they should limit the number of anglers on the trip or limit the number of anglers fishing at one time.

[Bill Kiene semi-retired]

I don't think people really know that there are any rules of engagement in fishing.

It's not printed anywhere that I know of?

There are new fly fishers daily that have no clue about any of this.

I guess it is good to talk about it here so they might read it and learn.

If I want to move in on someone I will usually compliment them on how nice they look in their waders and offer them a cold one. Works every time......

Years ago we fished so close in Shad lineups that we would take each others hats off while casting.

I really enjoy BSing and like most people, even spin-fishers, so if someone moves in on me it's great. I just make another friend.........

Hell, I worked in a bait-n-tackle shop so everyone that fishes in my friend, as long as they are within the laws and use deodorant.

[hikenfish]

Kurt-
While I don't condone other fishermen invading your water/s and space, I've put up with Nevadans fishing at Caples, Frenchmans, and Davis when the fishing is on, as I'm a "Sh-t-head from California" as one Nevadan put it years ago at the nets. I actually felt guilty as though I was in a special person's lake from there at the time. Although I probably felt remorse and anger towards the invading crowds whereever I fish nowadays, I almost broke up with friends over this argument, and decided it is a sign of the times with more people wanting to fish. Your possible ambivalence towards this issue as a "local Dude" is that maybe you forget when the shoe is on the other foot.


Sincerely,
Brian O'Rourke (aka hikenfish), originally from Pennslyvania.

[jayclarkflyfishing]

There is a serious lack of etiquette taking place at Pyramid this year.I had someone move in on me yesterday morning.He was uncomfortably close and I was in a foul mood but I bit my tongue grabbed my ladder and moved down the line to a less crowded spot.I was pissed but luckily was able to let it go and I had a great day!

Kurt,I know how you feel and this problem seems to get worse with each passing year.Thanks for posting your concerns.I'm staying with Ernie next week and I hope to fish we get a chance to fish with you!

Jay Clark

[michaeln]

There could never be a fishing situation that would get me to participate in a lineup or any kind of combat fishing scenario. I value my space and tranquility of the fishing experience too much to put up with it.

I realize a lot of guys do it, but I never could.

[Ed Wahl]

I've learned to love both the crowds in a line up and absolute solitude. Each in their own place.
Line ups are common in valley rivers and apparently in Pyramid. You have to adjust your idea of etiquette for these places. Too close is when you're hooking each other. It's a blast to hit the shad run with a bunch of strangers who rather quickly become friends as we each learn off one another.

On the flip side, when fishing my preferred streams in the Sierras, I consider it rather crowded if I see one other fisherman during the day. Etiquette there is a bit different. Upon spotting another fisherman upstream of me I'll quietly slip up out of the gorge into the trees and walk at least a half mile up from him before getting back in the water. That way by the time he fishes up to where I got in the fish will have calmed down again and he'll never know he's fishing behind someone.

When done correctly my solitude is only interrupted for a few minutes and the other angler's not at all.

Can't wait for summertime.

Ed


Ed

[Ted S.]

We've had similar problems at Hat Creek in the past. The guys leading the club fishouts need to be responsible for keeping their neophytes under control.

Old55


P.S. Never heard of the "Santa Clara Fly Club". Is there such a thing?

[speyfool]

Maybe in those circumstances (when someone crowds you), it is time to start spey casting (just to take up as much side to side space as possible) big huge flies the size of small animals. Make sure you look like you don't know what you're doing and your casting is rather unpredictable.

:D

[DFrink]

Ed,

Sounds so simple, unfortunately some people just can't grasp the concept.


I've learned to love both the crowds in a line up and absolute solitude. Each in their own place.
Line ups are common in valley rivers and apparently in Pyramid. You have to adjust your idea of etiquette for these places. Too close is when you're hooking each other. It's a blast to hit the shad run with a bunch of strangers who rather quickly become friends as we each learn off one another.

On the flip side, when fishing my preferred streams in the Sierras, I consider it rather crowded if I see one other fisherman during the day. Etiquette there is a bit different. Upon spotting another fisherman upstream of me I'll quietly slip up out of the gorge into the trees and walk at least a half mile up from him before getting back in the water. That way by the time he fishes up to where I got in the fish will have calmed down again and he'll never know he's fishing behind someone.

When done correctly my solitude is only interrupted for a few minutes and the other angler's not at all.

Can't wait for summertime.

Ed


Ed

[Gregg Machel]

This reminds me of a trip I took with my son up in Montana. At the time I had been fly fishing less than a year and was on the Blackfoot river. I saw an older gentleman who really looked like he knew what he was doing and asked him if I could follow him and watch for a while. He of course didn't mind and we had some good conversation. We watched him fish for a while (20 minutes or so) and then decided we would give it a try also.

Looking back at this I see the errors of what I did next, but at the time it seemed perfectly normal and passive. We took out our gear and started fishing probably 20 ft from our new friend and as I recall he said something like ... "it looks like you have it now, I'll leave you to your waters" and he went upstream and continued his fishing. What I actually did was totally get into his space and crowded him, but I didn't know any better at the time and I think he realized this too and luckily was quite the gentleman about it.

When we left, I wrote him a note and left it on his car thanking him for his time, so hopefully that re-enforced the fact that I was a new fly fisher and appreciated the time he took to talk to us.